[Paul Covino]: Okay, today's Tuesday, July 8th at 5 or 4 p.m. beginning of the traffic commission meeting recording in progress. Those present here at the Medford Police Station, myself, Chief Bovino, Sergeant Larry Rogers, Sergeant Jordan Canava, and Alva Erickson. The members of the board, Alicia Hunt, Tim McGivern, Jim Silva, are all present, as well as myself. Mr. Berninski is not here today. And we're going to start with just approval of approval of the minutes from last week. I'm sorry, Sarah McDermott. Is also here from the traffic commission. I mean, the parking department. And also Todd Blake from the traffic engineers department. And we got everybody.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: So, yeah. Okay. Motion to approve June minutes.
[Paul Covino]: If somebody wants to move motion to approve the June minute minutes.
[Alicia Hunt]: I'll motion.
[Paul Covino]: Okay.
[Unidentified]: Second. Okay. Take it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Roll call.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner McGiven.
[Paul Covino]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt. Yes. Commissioner Silva.
[Paul Covino]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Cabino.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Nothing, we can just do 425-56 Handicap signs. Rosa Chavez. Okay, we're going to start with Handicap signs.
[Paul Covino]: 425-56 HP sign Rosa Chavez Durante, 12 Hale Avenue. Rosa, do you want to? Just trying to see if- Hold on, Rosa.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Chief, I went by today and I spoke to Rosa's sister. Rosa was at home. They do have a driveway. It's a very tiny driveway, very skinny, and you'll not be able to get a car in that driveway.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Rosa, if you're just here at the meeting, if you wouldn't mind just either raising your hand or putting in the notes here. I'm just not seeing you. There you are, okay. I'm just going to ask you to unmute and then we're going to pull up your street. Rosa just hit, hit unmute and you should be fine. Okay. Good evening, Rosa. How are you?
[SPEAKER_15]: I'm okay. How are you?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm just going to pull up your street here now.
[SPEAKER_15]: Okay.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Rose, if you kind of want to explain kind of why you're applying for that placard, don't need any medical. Any medical on you or anything like that? Just I'm pulling up the street here. So the commissioners can see, but just why you're applying. We have all the paperwork. It's all in order here on our end, but.
[SPEAKER_15]: I'm sorry, it's very hard to find a spot at the beginning of the street or in front of my house because there are cars that are parked from other streets that, you know, they're parking from the house. And with my medical issues, sometimes my husband has to help me cross the street or walk me through the corners straight into the house because of my sciatic and whatnot and my osteosis arthritis. We have contractors that come from other streets that park here. We have also people from other streets that park at the beginning of the street, as well as visitors or family from the condos of the street. And like yesterday, today's a very good days where, I mean, I did find a spot, but in as much pain as I am in, it's very hard, 90% of the time, trying to walk down the street with my illnesses. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Commissioners, any questions, commissioners?
[Alicia Hunt]: Thank you. I do see that there's a curb cut there, but that doesn't actually look wide enough to be a driveway.
[SPEAKER_15]: No, I cannot pull my car in. Oftentimes, I drive my husband's for the comfort and we can't pull it in. Right. It's very narrow. I wish we could because then I wouldn't be asking for a handicapped block. Interesting. And we have cars that park and they stay there for days on end. And I don't think it's right that I have to park on Massachusetts Street or Main Street. Why can't I park on my own street? Especially when sometimes I can't even walk.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I think we only have one other handcuff on the street, if I'm not mistaken. I think it's only one, right?
[SPEAKER_15]: Actually, it's no longer there. They actually left. They have left, but we used to have one for my father-in-law and mother-in-law right in front of our house. We still have a little hole on the sidewalk from the park, from the pole.
[Alicia Hunt]: There appears to be a handicap sign in front of 13 Hale Avenue.
[SPEAKER_15]: No, that has been censored, removed. Okay. They moved into another state. Okay. And we did have one in front of our house for my in-laws, but when my father-in-law passed away, we called the city to remove it because it was just right. Not knowing that I was gonna need it.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right. And I don't have an issue with this. It's not like the street is full of handicapped signs. You are aware that if, The sign goes up that it's not specific to you that anybody with a hand could legally use that spot, correct?
[SPEAKER_15]: Correct. Thank you so much. Is that a motion, Alicia?
[Alicia Hunt]: Unless somebody else has a comment before we move on.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: No objections.
[Alicia Hunt]: Then I'll motion to approve.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Motion. Second. Great.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner McGibbon?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt? Yes. Commissioner Silva?
[Jim Silva]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Covino?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: One absent.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay, motion has passed. Just give DPW some time to get the sign up and should be there in the next couple of weeks.
[SPEAKER_15]: Thank you so much. I appreciate all your time and effort to work this through.
[Paul Covino]: Great. Thank you. Very welcome. Thank you. Have a nice night. Thank you so much. Next item up is 2025-57, another HP sign for Antonio Barone, 29 Hamilton Street, Mr. Barone.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Chief, I won't buy today. There was no answer. My only concern is there's a very large driveway, whether it's his or not, right next door to the house, to the right of the house.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I don't know if you're present, please either raise your hand or. Okay, thank you. We're going to ask you on mute and then I'll pull up the street here for. Good evening. How are you?
[SPEAKER_06]: Good. How are you doing?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: So, like, we mentioned before, if you kind of like to. Explain kind of other than using any medical information and. Explain kind of why you're replying for the placard and we have all the information. here that's been paperwork, Alva, correct?
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Yes, I do.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: The paperwork has been submitted for us, so. If you want to kind of explain through, I'll pull up the street so that the commissioners can see the house.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I have chronic pain. When I do a long walk, whether it's 20 feet or 30 feet, my back kind of gives out, and I usually sit on the wall in front of my house, so I kind of compose myself.
[Alicia Hunt]: So really, our question is why do you need a spot? Like, why can't you use the driveway type? Like, what prevents you from parking at your house at this time? That's really what we need to know about. If you have a handicapped placard, that covers your medical piece of it.
[SPEAKER_06]: Well, I have a two-family house. We have three cars, and then my tenants have cars to pull out. If you notice in the picture, I don't know if you see the gates, there was gates put there where the yard is. Right now they're doing construction next door, so we kind of opened the gates so everybody can park in the yard. I don't know if the picture's an older picture or a recent picture.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Can you see the, we've shared the screen, can you see the picture that we have of the house here? Is this?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, that's my house, yep. With the bricks in the front.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: There's gates here. Obviously there's no gates here now.
[SPEAKER_06]: Halfway, if you like, go up into the driveway. Oh, I see it now. The gates fold in to each other and we close them off and, you know, chain it so it's a yard. And only four cars fit in the front. There's the gates right there, see them? Yeah, yeah. Once you close that, that's actually the yard back there. It's not the driveway. Because you're not supposed to have cars next to the back door. And if you notice, there's a back door. See the gate, there's two gates, one on the right-hand side of the house, one on the left-hand side of the house. Usually those are closed and chained, but they're doing a condominium next door, two-family condominium right next door to me. And there's trucks everywhere, so the tenants need a place to park. I just always usually park in front of my house, so I don't bother anybody. 33 Hamilton is two condos are going next door.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, it's in the construction.
[SPEAKER_06]: And that's the wall I actually sit on when I walk halfway up my driveway. I can't stop, compose myself. I have chronic injury in my spine.
[Paul Covino]: How many tenants do you have?
[SPEAKER_06]: There's two. Two, okay. There's usually four cars in the driveway. Yeah. The gates again, they're not closed because next door they were working. Yeah, I get it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I get it, yeah.
[Tim McGivern]: Commissioners, any... Any other handicapped signs around, Jordan?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I looked at the street. No, I don't believe there's any that we have that is listed. Um, and no objections to this.
[Paul Covino]: Yeah, I have no objections here.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Other commissioners, any other questions or we, um,
[Alicia Hunt]: And so you're saying you do put three cars in the driveway, just four?
[SPEAKER_06]: Sometimes there's four in the driveway.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right, because as a two unit, you're required to have parking on site for three cars.
[SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right.
[SPEAKER_06]: But what happens in the wintertime, it's worse. So we open the gates, and we let more cars park in, because when you have that snow band, to get the cars off the road, off the street. That's why we ended up dealing with the gates. There used to be a fence there, and I took it down a long time ago. And I came up with that idea so we could put more cars in, so no cars get towed away.
[Alicia Hunt]: We appreciate that, that you make space for more vehicles during snow events. And as we just said to the previous person, I assume you heard that if it's a handicapped parking placard, it is not specific to you and your vehicle, but rather anybody that has a handicapped parking placard would be able to use it.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yes, I understand. I know what you mean. If someone's there, you can't say anything.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right. We just like to be very clear because sometimes people in the past have thought that they are specific to them. So we just like to make sure everybody understands up front.
[SPEAKER_06]: I understand.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay. Commissioners. Tim, I don't know if that was a motion, but Commissioner Silver, I know. A motion to approve. I'll second. Great. Roll call, Alva.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner McGiven?
[Tim McGivern]: Yes, indeed.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt? Yes. Commissioner Silva?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Covino?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: One absent.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: As stated before, you know, the motion has passed and just give a few weeks here for FDW and public works to get the sign over there, but thank you. I appreciate your time.
[SPEAKER_06]: Thank you so much. Thanks everybody. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: You're very welcome. Okay, move on to 2025-58.
[Paul Covino]: We have another handicap sign for Raffaellina Maldonado, 118 Willis Avenue. It looks like it's to be posted on Right Ave.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Sarge, do you want to fill us in on that? Chief, I went by today, no answer. My only comment is there is a handicap sign at 120. Willis House. She is looking on right there, which would be the corner. She has a corner house at Willis and Wright House. Is there a resident parking there too?
[Paul Covino]: Yeah, correct. Because she's a corner house, so she can get a resident parking there too. She can. Good.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: But there is one at 120.
[Paul Covino]: 120 Willis, which is right next door. Excellent. Just book. Is this the house in the greenhouse? Yeah, we don't. Does that belong to one 20? I think she's, I think she's on here now.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I think I asked you on mute. Are you able to unmute?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm right here.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: You just wanna just explain why you're applying for the handicap placard, like we stated before for the other.
[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, I have a chronic condition called lipedema and the heaviness of my leg and pain. And I have better access to go back up and down the back of my stairs to the backyard to get to my house.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: This gray house is yours, correct?
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, right there, yeah.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: And you enter through the front or you enter through the back?
[SPEAKER_03]: the back is more helpful for me. Sorry. It's OK.
[Alicia Hunt]: And can you clarify? It looks like there's a parking garage in a driveway right there.
[SPEAKER_03]: Correct. And I did park my car there for a while. And the park clerk came by and said I couldn't park there because my car is too long. It sticks out to the sidewalk. So you don't put it in the garage? No, we already have, we've got two, we've got two family there. So we've got, I already have like three cars, four cars. There's already two cars in there. And the cars, they do stick out in the sidewalk.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Where did you say it was? The other handicap? Is there one at 120? On the front. On Willis Ave. but a left on the left. So I think you're a coach. I don't think you should be able to unmute. It should be right there.
[Sarah McDermod]: I just wanted to comment, I'm looking at the list of accessible spaces that we have, and this space at 120 will 70 was granted in 2010. I don't know if that's going to impact. I don't know if we want to see if that person is still using that space or. Yes, they do. They do. Okay. Well, I mean, it might be used by somebody because there's 113 Willis, 120 Willis, 195 Willis. 113, they do use theirs.
[SPEAKER_03]: all the time, and 120 does use theirs all the time.
[Sarah McDermod]: 113, that's been there since 92. I know. I know. Okay, I just wanted to chime in and let y'all know what the other ones were for, and if, just info on those.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm not seeing, do we have any on, is there any on Wright Ave?
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: No. Just at 113 Willis.
[Sarah McDermod]: There's one on Wright Ave, but it was granted to 113 Willis Avenue. Say, hold on. It might be the same guy. It's the same name. Same name on Willis and Wright.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay. Thank you. Sure. Commissioner, is there any?
[Alicia Hunt]: Is Wright Ave a one-way street? I was a little confused looking at it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: No.
[Alicia Hunt]: The direction signs were pointed.
[Jim Silva]: It's one way from Maine to Willis, and then it's two way from Willis to Pierce.
[Alicia Hunt]: Just the parking, the signs that exist, the slow children and parking by permit are on the left side of the street, which usually indicates a one-way street.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, so that would be a one way. Yeah, the one way is coming from this way.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, yeah. So would, uh, is the request for behind that pickup truck, the Toyota truck?
[SPEAKER_03]: I'm requesting it right where the Toyota truck is.
[Tim McGivern]: Oh, where the Toyota truck is. Okay. Yeah. And that's your entrance and those are your stairs.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[Tim McGivern]: Got it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I think there should be enough room. I was trying to get a better view for you, Tim, but there should be plenty of room. Right.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, it looks like there's a lot of middle community that we can see.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, you got, you got at least one that's plenty of room.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, I think, um, and we're, we're not causing any, like, congestion of handicap spaces or anything. There's a couple around the corner, but, um, there's a need and right out doesn't have any. So, I have no objection.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I have no objection either. Any other commissioners or Tim, is that a motion?
[Tim McGivern]: It can be a motion. I just, you know, I didn't know if anybody else had any objections. Otherwise it's a motion, sure.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Great, I'll second it.
[Tim McGivern]: I'll second.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Second, go right, roll call, Alva.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner McGibbon?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt? Yes. Commissioner Silva?
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Covino?
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: One absent.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Okay, Alva, do we want to specify where it's supposed to go?
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Yes, sir, it's to be posted on Wright Avenue.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: from about a foot from the driveway.
[Paul Covino]: Yeah, it should be as close as they can make it to that driver. They're blocking the driveway, making it difficult for people to get in and out.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: When I send the orders over, I will put that. Okay.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Just as we stated before, just give it a few weeks here for public works and DPW to get that installed. Motion is passed, so.
[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.
[Paul Covino]: So in Osborne? Yeah. 2025-59, safety improvements, Osborne Road and Wool Street, Placement Road. Todd Blake, you want to fill us in on that?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: If you want to run with me, I can upload the most flyers. It's all yours.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, thanks. So over the years, we've gotten requests to make improvements at a number of intersections throughout the city, including this one. This one's come up over the years. As far back as 2016 in a complete streets priority list, I think it was number 29 out of the amount that they looked at it. And we recently received another request or complaint about the area in general, usually involves, you know, cars are going too fast, not stopping the desire to have crosswalks and things like that, but due to capital limitations. We can't do well, we can't do crosswalks. We can't paint new crosswalks unless there are ramps as well. And that's a capital expense. So we'd like to do that, but it's a long list of ramps we have to do in the city as well. So, but we didn't want to continue to ignore the requests and concerns at this area. So this was one proposal to, um, to help remedy some of the issues, not all the issues, or improve some of the issues. I like to use the word fix or remedy because, you know, it's never seems to be 100%. But this will, I believe, help improve sight lines and reduce conflicts. So I'll show the rough sketch of what the idea is. Let me just share this. Actually, I'll go to the map first. So this is an aerial of the existing intersection. It's very wide and expansive, even though it's only one lane east direction. Osborne is currently a one-way from Pleistead to Winthrop Street. But it looks like remnants of when it must have been a two-way at one point. There's a median at Osborne with two entrances to get in. And what happens is, as described by some folks that have inquired, the stop sign and the stop line for Woburn is set way back here versus up at Playstead. And people coming from the south from West Medford Square come north on Playstead and take this angled right towards one of the openings in Osborne. And they kind of cut across traffic coming from Woburn. But if this intersection were done over from scratch today, it would be much tighter. And these folks that are trying to take it right onto Osborne. you know, one option is likely to go up here. If all my cars then take a more pronounced right turn so they go slower, that would enable the stop bar on Woburn to be pulled up much closer to playstead and enable that the drivers on Woburn to see if cars are coming up playstead or not. And it keeps that right turn up from kind of almost broadsiding those folks on Woburn. Now I'll try to bring up the graphic. So this is a graphic kind of indicating what it could look could be one of the potential options of many that could improve this in section by tightening it up and here at Woburn at Osborne could be moved closer to the police station section enabling that driver to look both directions and for police folks to see that car exiting Woburn. You could do this with paint. the yellow and white line moved with a new stop sign that would likely have to be mounted to like a planter barrel like we have a place that in Winthrop Street. And this graphic just indicated the potential to use physical elements to help instruct folks of the change and help prevent people, especially at the beginning from just disregarding new markings because a lot of people will drive on autopilot and not be aware of whatever changes we do end up making. So it reduces speed, reduces conflicts, improves sightlines with minimal costs. It's kind of seen as a quick build type treatment, meaning you could pilot something like this. And then if it does improve and people like it, you could work towards a capital project to physically implement it with curbing and things like that. But that's a much larger capital improvement project. which we don't have the resources for right now. So we try to do things like this quick, quick build and other season towns as well, because we want to improve as many places as we can with the limited resources we have. That's the gist of it. Do the commissioners have any question?
[Tim McGivern]: Does it kind of mirror the complete streets concept that was approved?
[Todd Blake]: It's actually the, The Complete Streets one that was in 2016 was the opposite. It closed the opposite entrance. But there's pros and cons to doing one versus the other. Because if you close the opposite and leave the opening, the one that's further down Woburn, that issue of people turning right from place that still exists. And they would either go right and go straight across, or they'd go right and then make a media left onto Osborne. So yeah, there's pros and cons. I was looking back into the prioritization list, Tim, for like, say, Tufts Square. It was similar. Tufts Square at the time had one proposed alternative in the complete streets list. Then when we got into preliminary design in a memo with the consultant, they looked at three options. The one that was presented plus two others. And it ended up switching as well from the original idea. So there's many things you could do. Some people have suggested one way, the opposite way. But that has pros and cons, too, because the cuts were just introduced the opposite way, and there's other types of issues. So balancing all that, this was the one that seemed to address some of the concerns. And do you think you could always pilot it for six months or something? Oh, yeah. Yeah, definitely. Thanks.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm sure there's no other questions. I'd like to put it out to the public to see if anybody from the public that would like to speak. Just one more. Yep, sorry. Got to commission.
[Tim McGivern]: I forgot. I was going to ask until right now when you said that the physical barriers, right? So, I know at place that we have the white and yellow, white and orange barriers. We do something similar here, or would it be what do you envision there for those barriers?
[Todd Blake]: So at the very least, the yellow, the double yellow being extended, and then the white line and the stop sign being moved. But to help protect the stop sign, and again, help reinforce the new way of doing things, something physical usually is necessary, because people just disobey the paint. Normally with the larger area, with the equipment we have, we'd do like a plastic water filled barrier. Some people don't like the aesthetics of those, but those enable us to use less of them and it's more obvious to people that's blocked off. We could also use the skinny cone flex posts. So in this scenario where I showed those potential barriers, they could be white flex posts, the skinny variety. And then you could also add yellow flex posts to the double yellow itself where that the right turner from place that used to cross over where it wasn't yellow before. We've done that at Emerson when we blocked maneuvers from Emerson onto Maine. So it could be a variety of things that we have available, but yeah, good question.
[Tim McGivern]: Good deal. I like the sound of all those. I think, you know, some people have commentary on what they see out there. So thank you. I'm good, Jordan.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm just going to pass it off to the public. If you have any comments on this, please raise your hand and we'll go in order in which we receive. If you have any issues raising your hand or can't figure that out, just put some comments into the
[Todd Blake]: Sorry, Joanne, briefly before we move on to resident comps, I just want the commissioners to know that engineering department, myself and the intern individually flyered every household on Osborne and about eight houses in each direction and placed it in Woburn. And then communication with Robocall, the larger area today, but we flyered last week so that we try to get response. Thanks.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I don't know what you guys think. Sorry.
[SPEAKER_18]: Hi, my name is Deanne Wary and I live on Woburn Street. And thank you, Todd, for your engagement on this ongoing challenge. While I would love a longer term solution, both for pedestrians, people in cars and people on bikes, because I find all three to be challenging at that intersection. I appreciate the interim proposal, it still does require a car to potentially make kind of two stops to take a right on Playstead because you'll have that new stop sign and then you'll still have to sort of slow down a little bit, but it will. I sort of tested it out this morning and you could see a little bit better down to the left on Playstead. If you're on a bike or if you're walking, you will kind of need to, you know, walk to that stop sign, walk to the stop sign on the other side of Osborne, walk halfway across Playstead and then walk the other half across Playstead just to get to Oak Grove. And the same goes if you're biking. So it is very challenging. But I do think that for safety, we need something because there's just zero sightline at the end of Woburn right now.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you. Mary, we're gonna go to you next. Just ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_23]: Yeah, the barriers that you were talking about, those are the ones that are right at the top of the place they wrote, correct?
[Todd Blake]: So there's two different types of place they wrote right now. Yeah, the original ones were the larger water filled plastic barriers, some orange, some white. And then we recently moved some of the orange away, the larger ones for the skinny white ones.
[SPEAKER_23]: And the one that, and the one pole, that flagpole, that's on the, going, a place that road to Winter Street, because those two have been knocked down. Those two have been knocked down, and the white barriers, three of them have been moved.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, so the DPW is going to follow up with us, fixing those to the ground so that they wouldn't be moved so easily. They were just positioned temporarily. We had to use the other barriers for a different purpose.
[SPEAKER_23]: So those have been there for what, two years? Is it two years? Or is it three? Are we going on three for those temporary barriers at the top of Pleistats?
[Todd Blake]: It's about two plus, yeah.
[SPEAKER_23]: Two plus, yeah.
[Todd Blake]: But I would argue that that's enabled us to have safety in those two plus years, right? So sometimes if we wait for a capital project, I know that it's very tough to... you know, pinpoint numbers, but a large in section like place that it went through would cost upwards of a million dollars to do it. Concrete, curbing, like tough square, like Hanes Square type of improvement. So this is a way to, that was a way to try to curb speeding for people coming from Winchester taking that big right turn. But I do understand the aesthetics, but these are the tools that we have. And if you have a preference, we'd like to hear, thank you.
[SPEAKER_23]: No, but at the top of that street, you also may know that crosswalk, you take your life in your hands on that too. The two bushes there, they overgrow, so if you're in the middle there, nobody sees you. But we'll go back to Osborne Road, because that's where I live, so. I'm good.
[Todd Blake]: Thank you. Tim, we can note that DBW could trim some of those hedges in the median.
[Tim McGivern]: I was going to ask if she could maybe write me an email about where that obstruction is. We can send someone out to get protocols for that. So a DPW office phone call or email would be fine.
[SPEAKER_23]: I actually have your, I have your card. You gave it to me when you guys did the street.
[Tim McGivern]: Okay. Yep. Just show me a quick email. We'll, we'll send someone out and take care of the obstruction.
[SPEAKER_23]: Okay.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you, Elizabeth. We're going to go to you now and asking on mute. Elizabeth, yeah, I think we may have lost you here.
[izVdDtzaCdw_SPEAKER_24]: Sorry, I couldn't unmute myself, but I guess somebody finally let me. Thank you very much. I'm Elizabeth Crouchite. I live on Diane Road, just a block down from the intersection at Osborne that we're talking about. I picked up a piece of litter on Placid Road the other day, and it turned out to be the notice of this meeting. So I'm really glad that either someone dropped it or the wind blew it. I wanted to echo Mary's comment about the obstruction of the bushes at Placid Road. Thank you for saying that. I drive and take this right at this intersection with Osborne. I bike, I walk. I also walk with the dog. I'm super in favor of you trying this. I think it's a great idea. Thank you so much. I understand the limitations of the temporary barriers and all that, but I think that doing it on a pilot basis makes sense. My entire family is going to be very appreciative of this. One thing I was wondering is, because I can't really tell from the drawing, is Is it possible with these temporary barriers, whatever, to slightly change the line of that, what will now be a much sharper right turn? Because right now, the way the road is angled, Osborne, so I'm not sure, since we're not changing the median itself for that little island, I wasn't sure if the barriers could be used to soften that angle a bit. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Todd, I think you best answer that. I lost Todd.
[Alicia Hunt]: Sorry, I just had my internet drop for a minute. I think we're having trouble in City Hall with our internet.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: OK. Just give us one minute. Yeah, we'll try and. Get back when a director Blake is back on here and kind of you can probably answer best if the they're able. I don't see why there shouldn't be an issue where they could slow that curve down with that right turn. But we. I can only speak for Emerson street, but once we got the high barriers on Emerson street, it's, it's, it's been a world of change here from Emerson at main, but, um, I know that there was a couple, uh, different ways that they changed main street from South and main street at Emerson and place that. So I think it's, it's definitely a temporary where they need feedback from all the residents to kind of let us know what's working and what's not working. Cause if we don't hear any feedback, whether it's good or bad, then we're not going to know. So, um,
[Tim McGivern]: I missed a lot of that, but I get the gist of it. I mean, the reason I was asking Todd about the types of the barriers is because we'll probably start by doing the movable water ones. And then if things look, we'll tweak those and we can change curves and make things safer. And then it's an iterative process. And then we anchor things to the pavement, those bollards. And then like Todd was saying, we line up a capital project eventually. So two plus years is actually a short amount of time that is still within the range of temporary. Temporary can be five years in this world or more. So just wanted to mention that. So that's kind of the process that we would go through.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I just texted him.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, I did too.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Once Director Blake comes on, we can kind of re-air.
[Tim McGivern]: Ask that question again, but yeah, see if it's he probably knows if it's the feasibility of it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: We'll move on to Peter and ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_19]: Hi, yeah, this is actually Michelle. I'm on my husband's account, whose name is Peter. I actually, Tim kind of answered part of my question, which I was going to ask how long temporary barriers typically stay up for. But I was curious, you mentioned this could be a pilot. How do pilots typically work, and how do you determine if it's working or if it's not? I'm just newer to the area, so I was curious if someone could address that.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm just going to ask if Todd is back on.
[Tim McGivern]: If not, I could feel that.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I mean, I mean, I, I'm not sure he's not back on. He just texted says he's having an Internet issue. So I can only speak for the 1 we have here on Emerson itself. Emerson, we had 8 collisions and 7 or 8 weeks and. We have now turned Emerson street has had no collisions other than somebody colliding with cones since that was enacted. I think that was about a 16 months ago. Main itself had 32 collisions on state and city roads. And we have only had 3 collisions since that was there, and that's been there 2 years. I'm not sure of other ones that I'm missing. I can't really speak and on to how long this will be a temporary 1, maybe commissioner given if you could maybe give a right. Yeah.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, and I would only say that, as Todd mentioned, this is a complete streets target project. So it's on the priority list back from 2016 or 17 when we did that. So there's data associated with those as far as crashes and whatnot. And then also, just from a design standpoint, the design of this intersection is terrible. We know that it creates conflicts just because of the design. So we would look at data from the police as far as crashes goes. motor vehicle accidents, whatnot, pedestrians as well. And the idea would be those would go down, less people are complaining. Hopefully, we're only getting complaints about the ugly barriers, things like that. But we've created a safer situation. But if there are issues, sometimes there are issues. We like to iron those out as much as we can before we actually put curb in the ground. Engineers make mistakes, get radiuses wrong and things like that. So sightlines and radii, I believe one of the women commented on, we take those types of things into consideration, move things around, tweak them, and then that turns into a more permanent project. But as far as timeline and funding goes, that's the biggest thing. So funding has a long timeline to it. this would go on a capital project list. And that could be five, six, seven years out, depending on how we do the priority list and how we fund it from the state. And I think Todd said this is kind of down in the list. So if we're going for that funding, it would be more than five years, because there are other intersections that would be ahead of this one that we would do with hardscaping. Hopefully that answers the question.
[SPEAKER_19]: Yeah, that does. I'm just curious, do you have any current data for that intersection that you could share?
[Tim McGivern]: Probably do let the police talk, but we probably have the old data for a complete streets that and then whatever the police have now.
[SPEAKER_19]: Okay, great. And how can I reach out to you to get that data?
[Tim McGivern]: Todd's not on the call, but any design information that he's using or looking at, he can share with you. I'm sure that's what he would talk about maybe here. And I don't know if, Jordan, you want to talk about things that you've seen?
[Alicia Hunt]: We have Todd here now. He came in.
[Tim McGivern]: Oh, OK.
[Todd Blake]: Sorry about that, folks. We had a connection issue. Tim, I think Tim answered everything spot on. The one thing I would add is, regardless of the data, sometimes Sometimes the issues aren't necessarily apparent in actual crashes, it's more near misses. So just by us knowing that there's issues, I would fear that if we did nothing, you know, not the quick build stuff, and then there happens to be an incident, you know, we're aware of the concerns, so we should do something about it, right? So we want to prevent crashes, not necessarily just respond to when they happen, so.
[SPEAKER_19]: Okay, yeah, absolutely. That makes sense. But I think where I'm having a little bit of trouble is just like measuring the success than if it's more like preventative. So I don't know, do you have like a method that you use typically if it's more of a preventative measure to see if it's being successful?
[Todd Blake]: So just as Tim mentioned with the capital expenses, same thing with studying and collecting a lot of data. I mean, we could get crash data simply from the police net before and after, but again, it might not show up as apparent as some like Maine itself does. But sometimes we go straight to improvements without an extensive study process because that also has soft costs associated with it. So we'd rather put whatever costs we do have in implementation versus Because in the past, the city has been criticized before, most of us have been working here, that they study something, put it on the shelf, and nothing ever happens. So we try to take that to heart and do the best we can. But these are all valid and important questions that you're asking.
[SPEAKER_19]: OK, thank you. And sorry, I know I'm using a lot of time. So I just have one more quick question. I walk my dog in that area a lot. When I cross the street, the middle median, actually the brush is pretty high. So if you're redirecting traffic to the left side there, I can't see cars coming that way through the brush. So I'm also wondering if we could cut that back as well.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, any tree trimming or bush trimming or cutting back, I'm usually all for it. So I'm all about sight lines. The better sight lines, the better chances you get drivers and pedestrians and cyclists to make good choices, right?
[Tim McGivern]: And in the interest of not taking up more time here, if you could do me a favor, give the DBW office a call. They can get the precise information from you as to where that obstruction is, and we'll take care of that one as well.
[SPEAKER_19]: Awesome. Thank you so much. I appreciate your time.
[Tim McGivern]: You're welcome.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Jen, we're gonna go with you here and ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_17]: Okay, thank you so much. My name is Jen Bernheisen. I'm a Woburn Street resident as well. And I just wanted to thank the commission for addressing this issue. I, you know, drive and walk through this intersection as do my kids daily. And I'm hopeful that we can, you know, I really appreciate the addressing the traffic issues with it. The sight lines are really rough coming out of Woburn streets. And I'm hoping that at some point we can also talk a little bit about how to make it a little bit safer for pedestrians. I know that this should help a little bit, but I'm hoping that we can think a little more about. It's a very high pedestrian area for a lot of the folks that live in this neighborhood. And so I'm hopeful that we can also be thinking about that at some point in the future. But thank you so much for putting this on the list and working towards some solutions to this intersection.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, that's a great point. I do want to say, since you brought that up, this improvement I believe will help all modes, vehicles, bicyclists, and pedestrians. So, as Tim mentioned, we can be flexible with the radii and different things. If we use those physical barriers in some form, that essentially creates an island, a refuge for pedestrians to walk behind to get them closer to where they want to go. So it is for all modes. My apologies if it sounded like it was just crash vehicle on vehicle.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'd like to kind of another street that we, we did, uh, Todd and I was, uh, Maine and, and, uh, sorry, uh, Winthrop itself. This was an intersection that we, you know, had multiple studies on that similar intersection to this. Um, we had brought up safety concerns and, um, luckily we didn't, we, Had a pedestrian collision there and luckily it turned out okay, but it was an intersection that we knew about that. We should have changed. And as long as I'm here on the. Having a voice, I'll never allow some safety concerns to come forward that we are going to be able to make some sort of improvement on. So I know the residents, you know, there may be not exact data that we can go off of here, but with everyone in the commissions and the police departments, we drive around and we see these intersections and we understand quickly how sightline or safety may be an issue. And this is 1, that's a main reason that we had this traffic commission meeting along with other things. to be in July so that we didn't have to wait until the next traffic meeting to bring this up. There's no sense in our collective minds being together here for a safety issue when it's right in front of our faces, but that's just my comment on it.
[Alicia Hunt]: Chief, there is one comment in the chat with somebody saying that they're not in a good place where they could unmute and speak. Do you want me to just read it out loud for them?
[Paul Covino]: Sure, absolutely.
[Alicia Hunt]: Their name is Catherine Mather. They say apologies. I'm not in a great place to unmute and speak, but I live on the corner of Woburn Street and Smith Lane, about a block from this intersection. I just wanted to add my voice in support of this temporary fix. I've seen so many near misses here in the past 10 years I've lived in the neighborhood. While it certainly doesn't solve all the safety issues with this intersection, it seems like a relatively low effort and high end picked way to get started. Um, there were also some people who, um, put some followup comments to their original. Um, I don't know if you wanted to take followup comments.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, we just have, uh, I'm okay with followup comments as the chief is. Yeah. Um, seems like we have iPhone, uh, three, three, nine, two, two, one, zero. Uh, If you'd like to unmute, I'll ask you to unmute and then you can, I'm not sure if you want to just state your name and if you live in the area.
[SPEAKER_22]: Hi, my name is Linda Morelli. I live on the corner of Playstead and Rubin Street. I've lived here for 60 years. And my main concern is the aesthetics of this area and the safety. I have spoken to Todd multiple times, gave him my feelings, and I guess it wasn't addressed tonight at all. 60 years, there are not many. Alicia, are you laughing at me? I hope not.
[Alicia Hunt]: I saw your email in the materials we were given, which is what Todd was just saying to me. I forward her email. But please go on. OK.
[SPEAKER_22]: So as far as people saying that this is a good idea, absolutely not. We're going to put barriers. People are gonna go through them. The same thing is happening on the top of Playstead Road. This is just not acceptable. If you're putting a bandage on something because of an email that someone in the city got, that is totally not acceptable. After 60 years, I've complained multiple times. Nothing ever gets done. Ask for sidewalks. to be fixed, as for walkways to be fixed, they do nothing, they don't have the money. This is not acceptable. Now you're going to put yellow lines, put a bandage on it, and not bother with anything else? This needs to be delayed. It needs to be looked at a little bit closer. People that do not live on the corner are looking to say, oh, this is a great job. No, it isn't. The only traffic that this is going to happen is at night when the kids come down the street with their cars. 60 years, this cannot happen. It's not acceptable. You could put barriers somewhere else, but not on the corner of a place that ain't moving. With the traffic, they'll go right into it. You need to delay this, think a little harder, and to do it now in the summer when people are finding notices on the street. Why wasn't it announced sooner? You need to do something a little bit better. So please consider doing it. You should have read what I told Todd. And so everyone is aware. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Man, if you'd like to read it, I'm not. I'm not sure of the email, but you're more than happy to read it on the... I don't have it in front of me right now, but Todd has it.
[SPEAKER_22]: I don't know if he gave it to Alicia. It should have been read to the people. And you never did like a traffic study. How can you put lines on anything without a traffic study? It doesn't make sense. You need someone out there looking at the traffic, counting the numbers to say that there's a lot of traffic. It's not even acceptable. There's not hardly any traffic. Traffic is at the top of Playstead and Winthrop Street. So we have these barriers and every day or every other day, the city people come and refix the barriers. We can't put band-aids on this anymore.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you. I'm not sure, but I believe this is the email and read it. I'm going to read it. And if it's, if it's different than you sure can correct it.
[SPEAKER_22]: Okay. If it's an email, it's fine.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: 205 place that road, Linda Morelli contacted a director Blake about the item, but is unable to attend the meeting. She requests. I share her comments. I believe she does care about improving safety and wants something to be done, particularly on place, Ted slash will burn. Not so much Osborne. She believes paint is fine slash OK, but she does not support the use of barriers or flex posts. She doesn't like the aesthetics of those treatments. Her preference is a physical island with curbing, etc. More like Haines Square is the example she gave. That is the email we have, is that correct?
[SPEAKER_22]: It absolutely is. Thank you very much for going ahead and reading that. Again, I'm going to say this is not an answer. And I was told, don't know if this is true. I was told today that there was a specific email sent to the mayor about this about a month ago. So sent a month ago and now it's all done. I tried to get the email from Alva. I called her multiple times. She said she was gonna speak with the acting police chief and see if I could get it, because evidently the email is not confidential. Don't know if that's right either, because if it's public knowledge about the public, then maybe I should be able to get it. So please look into this a little more. Do not vote on this tonight and consider what is going on in this area. This is a residential area. And to put a band-aid, you're going to have more accidents by putting yellow lines on the street. I guarantee it. I think in 60 years, I might have seen five, maybe 10 accidents, not on Rubin Street, where people come down Woburn Street and take a left on Playstead because they're going too fast. So to say that there's a lot going on there is absolutely not the truth. Thank you for listening. I hope you'll consider what I've said. Thank you again.
[Paul Covino]: Mr. Morelli, this is Chief Covino. You will be getting a response from us regarding the information request, the public information that we sent you. However, we did redact, will be redacting the name of one of the persons in the neighborhood that sent that originally. It seemed that you made a specific request for that person's name. So I'm not going to give information out that may cause conflict within the neighborhood. We're here at a public meeting. It's being discussed here. There are people here that are for this issue and people that are against it, as yourself. It sounds your problem as you don't like the aesthetics. I agree with you. Not the best looking thing out there. But I disagree on the fact that it's not going to help. There are problems in that intersection. It's a difficult intersection to navigate as far as coming out of Woobin Street to Placid Road. This will enable us to get the stop sign in the proper area to stop traffic before they end to place that road from urban street. And it is temporary. If it doesn't work, we'll take it away. We'll talk about it. And another time a year or so from here, if it doesn't work. If it does work, and the city can get money to make it a better looking island or something, that will happen too. But we can't turn our head to something that's a safety issue that could become a catastrophic accident in the middle of a place that is on Woolman Street. So I apologize if you're not happy with how we're doing this, but this is how it's going to happen. So I'm going to start this way. and maybe at some point in time the city will have money to make it um a better looking project and also in that time we may have time to adjust what's out there for barriers and things so that they work better but we need to start somewhere and unfortunately this is the way we're going to have to stop um and we will be voting on it today so i apologize if you disagree with me but um there is there is no serious safety issue here that we have to address and just turn a blind eye to that. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay I'm going to go to Peter and then if anybody else has any other questions we're going to have to raise a hand. Peter I'm going to ask you on your business.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, hi, good afternoon, everybody. My name is Peter column, I we own the house on the corner of Osborne and Winthrop at 598 Winthrop Street. A few follow up questions to the, the questions that were just answered. Why does this have to happen today is my first question. because that was what you just said. We have to vote on this today. What is the urgency of today, July 8th, of this happening today? And I have a few follow-up questions as well. I just wanted to follow up to what you just said. I don't share that urgency.
[Paul Covino]: I said we're going to vote on it today because it's presented to us. We may vote to table it. That's not the issue of having it immediately. That's helpful. But let me say this. It is a temporary solution. It gives us an idea moving forward, whether it's today or next month. So as a person who lives there, I think you want to make it a little safer. And then you could also help us in the future to readjust if it means changing that.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's that's my I very much I'm interested in making it safer. I think the question of how we make it safer and the conclusions we're drawing of what would make it safer. That's up for discussion and hopefully we allow for time for that to happen. My next question is, I've been listening to the meeting. And what data are we using to make this decision today? I heard the term close call. So could you define a close call and how many close calls have happened in 2025 year to date? I don't think we can.
[Alicia Hunt]: Can I comment on that? If we wait for data, people could die, right? We don't track, there is, you know, every resident knows that there's no way to track close calls because you don't call the police for a close call, right? That's our concern.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know that, that's why I'm asking this question. I don't know if there's a close call is defined by citizens calling and complaining. I don't know if it's people that are stopped by the police. I don't know if it's, here's I have no idea what a close call is. So I would like the MPD traffic unit to define that because I would expect us to make data driven decisions. So is there a definition for close call? Or is that just
[Paul Covino]: No, there isn't a definition. I'm sure there is. We do not document close calls. There are people in the neighborhood that are there all the time, like yourself, that see these things. They're the ones that brought this to our attention.
[SPEAKER_02]: So how many complaints, I guess, would be my question? Because if we're not documenting close calls or data, like how many complaints have we gotten year to date?
[Paul Covino]: Complaints about near hit, near hit? I don't know. We don't document them. We don't have that type of documentation. But when you logically go to that intersection, see where the stop sign is coming out of Woburn Street and look to your left, what do you see?
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't appreciate the terms logically, because I mean, if someone disagrees with you, then that's implying that they're not logical.
[Paul Covino]: Okay, then I won't say logically.
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's say you stop. Because logically we should fill a lot of the potholes on Playstead, but that hasn't been done, and I've called to complain about that.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: You're asking us to ask a question, and we're going to try and answer it for you, but if you keep interrupting when we're trying to answer it, then we're not able to answer the full question. So if you're going to ask us a question, we're going to try and answer it for you. Can we do that?
[SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely.
[Paul Covino]: So when you come out of Woburn Street to proceed down to Playstead Road, the stop sign is before Osborne, correct?
[SPEAKER_02]: according to your description, yes.
[Paul Covino]: When you look to your left, you still have a great distance to travel to proceed to Playstead Road, which most cases what people do is they accelerate from the stop sign after making a stop and continue. And they can't see the vehicles coming west on Playstead Road in the same direction that they're going to go. So have there been accidents before? I'm sure they have. I don't have documentation of that. But does it make sense for us to look at that and say, this can be done better? We can move this stop sign up and we can also slow down the people turning from Woolman Street onto Osborne at the same time.
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think just, I just want to make sure you're done. I'm not jumping. Yeah, I think that no one's questioning, like making things safer. I think the question right now that we have is, you know, what is going to make people safer? I think moving the stop sign makes a lot of sense. I don't think cutting off access. I think people will get confused. I mean, we live on this road. We walk our dog. I go running on this road like I have never seen. I've never seen this before, and I'm totally open to listening, but then to not see any data, not see number of complaints. I mean, I'm sure that the town tracks major accidents. We have accidents, sure. We track all our accidents. So how many accidents have happened in that area this year? We're trying to find. Is it available online? Because I can Google it while other people are asking questions.
[Paul Covino]: It may be through the insurance, the state insurance agency that they document all the crashes in different locations throughout the state.
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, wouldn't it be logical to look at that data when making this decision? That's just where I'm kind of, I don't question that.
[Paul Covino]: I think it's just as logical to be able to stand there and look at what potentially can happen. Those things we can't measure is what we prevent. And we know that if a person drives down that street, stops at that stop sign, and accelerates out, and crashes to someone else who's already going 25 to 30 miles an hour and placed that road, there's going to be a serious accident. And all we're saying is, let's try this. I know it doesn't look all that great, but let's try it and see if it slows that traffic down from the potential accidents out there.
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what we're saying. And how did this question come to consideration? Because it sounds like there's a lot of stakeholders were kind of like dancing around. Was it the police? Was it someone on? Was it enough people voted? Was it like how did this come up for discussion?
[Paul Covino]: It was brought into the traffic commission, I believe, by residents and residents or a couple of residents in the area. And then Mr. Blake can explain how he got involved.
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't have that information. My question is, did one resident bring this up and then you guys just decided to move forward? Like again, it doesn't.
[Alicia Hunt]: Can I interject something? So the chief is an interim chief. And so this is the second traffic commission that he's been at. So he may not have the information that for many,
[SPEAKER_03]: That's good for us.
[Alicia Hunt]: Now, we have both a list that we work down, a complete streets list, and we respond to resident concerns. And residents contact the city, and we investigate whether those concerns are actually concerns that we can do anything about. I would never say that whether or not they're legitimate, because all concerns are legitimate. But is this something we can do about? Do we have the funding to do something about this? And then we move and I'm afraid that I lost my Internet completely in the middle of that. Because everybody froze, we can hear you back now. We can hear you.
[Tim McGivern]: You can yeah, you did pretty good. You cut out small for a moment, but.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Get to Mary.
[Paul Covino]: No, I think Alicia just said a statement about how.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, she was talking about the complete streets list and how it looks like she might be back.
[Alicia Hunt]: Sorry, I switched the internet to my phone because it was too unstable. But right, it's just that we investigate all the complaints and the concerns we get from residents. And sometimes it's one resident and sometimes it's 50. And I'm unclear, as a person who cares about improving the safety of the city, why it matters whether we've heard from one resident or 50 residents on something. Like that doesn't make the situation less.
[SPEAKER_02]: Because there's trade-offs and there have been complaints that haven't been responded to for other traffic issues in the city. So it just doesn't make sense to me. Like I'm surprised that there's such aggravation with asking about the process. I'm just asking about, so you've confirmed that one person can make a complaint a separate person can then go validate it and then we vote on it. And I am surprised if the data is not here, why isn't that data available at the hearing where we're talking about voting? That's just, it baffles me. So I appreciate your answers on how we got here. It's just surprising to me that we wouldn't want to have all this information as we make trade-offs for how to spend our time and what to talk about, because there's plenty of other areas and concerns in the city that aren't being responded to. So I'm just gonna check here. You know, you have valid- I'm sorry, I can't hear you.
[Todd Blake]: Well, you have valid concerns and questions, but in the interest of time, there's other people, so we're just- Yeah, I'm all done.
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm responding to people directly speaking to me, so I'm all set. Thank you for answering.
[Todd Blake]: One thing I haven't heard is what would you like to see there versus all the things, apparently, with the process you're concerned about, which is fine, but what would- to get straight to the point, to try to cut through the red tape, right, what would you like to see there?
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, absolutely. I think moving the stop sign makes sense. I don't think that cutting off and restricting, I think it's going to cause mass confusion because we see people that commute every single day that are reliant and use that as a way to get to Winthrop, especially with all the traffic around the high school. I do think that in a quick, hasty change, we will have more accidents of people who are confused. And I also think as a follow up, it will be a huge eyesore, but that's my secondary concern because I haven't heard a timeline to transition if this does work, what it will look like other than probably just orange barriers that we're gonna put up and just call it a day.
[Paul Covino]: We're not shutting the street down, correct?
[SPEAKER_02]: There's two entry points and from my understanding, one entry point is going to be closed off and it's going to create a sharper turn for people coming off of, I believe it's whichever the right turn is onto Osborne.
[Todd Blake]: Sharper turns in the entire traffic industry, nationwide, worldwide, sharper turns are actually what we prefer these days versus wide open turns like Winthrop's Place did, because they encourage slower speeds, the sharper, the more 90 degree turn there is. So there are consistently complaints about speeding in this area. over and over again. So these are elements at both ends of these blocks that we're attempting to improve stuff. I just wanna say something about the study and it gets back to resources. So the process, this traffic commission exists since the 60s. This is Medford's process to discuss these types of issues. So again, we've had complaints in the past where you could spend the time and money to hire some consultants, study it, when you also have professionals like on the police, DPW, and myself that could cut through all that and get quicker, cheaper, to the point. So this, yes, there are different ways of going about doing this, but we've been criticized in the past for doing those things. We have years of experience. We could look at a situation and assess it and make some options. You're right that there are always trade-offs. You know, any any proposed solution is going to have trade-offs and you try to weigh those things and we all have experience in the industry and in the city that help us cut quicker to the point instead of making people wait and yeah it's not my proposal so it's i'm not proposing to bring in consultants i'm asking for just basic data how many accidents have we had
[SPEAKER_02]: How many complaints have we had? How many speeding tickets have been given? And then how does that two collisions compare to the other dangerous intersections in Medford? And then maybe we rank it based on where the most accidents are happening.
[Todd Blake]: so the 2016 prioritization plan did just essentially what you're saying without crashing it was a public meeting process to rank intersections throughout the city that was that was super helpful thank you for sharing what was the ranking of this intersection but this in section was unranked they only ranked the top 20 officially this one was scored i think number 29 and just this is what i'm We're trying to explain to folks that Medford has resource issues, just like any other city or town, right? So Haines Square was one of the intersections on this top 20 list. It was like number three or four. Tufts Square was like number three or four. So those were top five in the city at that time for that particular list. And no list is going to be perfect, but that was basically created from both of those projects upwards of a million dollars. So what I'm trying to explain to you and communicate, hopefully it's coming across, instead of waiting one project every five, 10 years, we're trying to address hundreds of projects every year to help improve things faster and not wait for the perfect solution. So hopefully that gets across to folks. We would love to do as much as we can for every street, every intersection we can, but unfortunately that's not the reality. So these are quick build, industry accepted standards to do quick-build type treatments, and then you call it pilot to permanence. You could try out something, and then if it works, that could lead to a $500,000 million project later. This is not just Medford doing these things. It's every city or town in the Commonwealth, every major metropolitan city in the country and in the world. So it's like, I don't really understand the, yeah, Anyway, so I would suggest to get through, you know, get to the point, get to, you know, hear what people actually want to see in terms of improvements there. And then we could get to the crux of, you know, that's why this meeting exists, so that all the members that vote could hear all the sides of the story and make informed decision about what they would like to do, whether it's table approvals or something else. Hopefully that helps. Thanks.
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it does. Thank you for answering my question. I'm trying to move on. I would recommend moving the stop sign. I would not recommend closing off that one entryway to the intersection. I don't think it makes a ton of sense to do that. And again, like I hear the ranking, I would like to see where can I find that list? Because I'm assuming nobody has it ready today to share.
[Todd Blake]: we could provide that, that list that we're referring to is the list at one moment in time, and it was created to be able to be eligible for a particular funding source that we've used very successfully since then. But that's not the only list, and it's not, I would say, not a list of all the issues that people have throughout the city. It's one list that has been used for that particular funding source, and we have, completed many of the things on that list, but we're still working through it in this many other lists. We have 730 plus streets and 1600 plus intersections in the city. So we're trying to work through them as fast and as efficiently and as safely and, you know, try to actually improve things for the residents, believe it or not.
[SPEAKER_02]: And how could I get that list as a follow up? Because I'm just trying to follow the process. So who will provide it? Or who should I ask?
[Tim McGivern]: You can probably follow up with engineering, right?
[Todd Blake]: It's difficult because I'm not at my computer. I could add stuff to the chat.
[Tim McGivern]: I can answer. Peter, you can call the engineering division of the DPW and request a copy. The clerk will help you, whether it's getting it to the proper website or sending it to you via email.
[SPEAKER_02]: Awesome. And how long would the pilot period be that you just mentioned? Because if the change does proceed, like how long? How long will the barriers be up and all of that?
[Tim McGivern]: Well, we get to decide here. I'm sorry if I'm stepping in on behalf of the commission here, because we could set it here. So this addresses another comment that you made. This isn't the vote for the permanent project by any means. So this is a pilot. This is something that, as Todd mentioned, is part of the process here in Medford with the Traffic Commission and how we make traffic rules and change the regulations. The standard of care doesn't really involve data. So this is a poor design. of an intersection with the public officials that have spoken today all believe that there are safety issues that are inherent in the design. That's why it's been on that list. That's why it's been on the city's radar for decades at this point. So with that said, we can set a pilot period tonight. It would be in the motion. So I was thinking, and this is to my other commissioners, we look at it for a year, something along those lines. We have different materials that I brought up earlier, so a lot of people don't like the water filled barriers. You know, we have nicer looking materials that we kind of have to wait to install until after the barriers and what else? Yeah, and there will be a vote on whatever permanent project there is all these complete street intersections that we work through. They all get a traffic commission vote because we are changing geometry and traffic regulations at the same time. No, that's not a motion folks. That was just me responding to Peter to give him information.
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. I'm all set for now. I appreciate it.
[Unidentified]: Not a problem.
[SPEAKER_02]: You can always call DPW if you've got more questions.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Mary, it looks like you have your hand up. I'm just going to ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_23]: Yeah, I have two questions. One of them is, most of the, I've lived here since 1968, right on Osborne Road, and I'm in the middle. I'm not at either end. But I was here and we went before the commission at the high school in the little theater to make it a one-way. And the reason we didn't do it from the top coming down is because five cars were totaled, trying to cut short going from Winthrop Street right onto Osborne Road. And then that was the best way to do it. That's number one. But number two was here. Many of these almost-missed or close calls whatever we want to call it, and we're all here to make sure that everyone is safe. Come from the people that go right through that stop sign on moving street. They blow right through it. I see it every day. I walk my dog when I was walking with my husband. They blow right through that, and then they come out towards Playstead Road, and as the Playstead people are coming up, they don't stop at that sign way back there. I don't know what's gonna stop them from stopping. I don't know that it's gonna stop them if we're moving it 15 feet up. I think it's gonna be a rolling stop sign just 15 feet further up, and they're gonna try to roll right onto Playstead Road, which is what many of them do. The ones that really do almost stop are the ones that are taking the turn onto Osborne because it is a sharper turn. So that's just my opinion. I do have a question. In the winter, we have those Jersey barriers up or whatever kind of call it, what we want to call those barriers. Is the snow, when they plow the snow coming down, is the snow going to pile up there? Are they going to move the Jersey barriers, plow all the way down, put the Jersey barriers back there? if that's going to cause a visual problem with people walking or people driving if the stop sign is there on the right. See what I'm saying? Anybody?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Tim, you wanna, I believe there's a- Sure, I can take that one, Jordan, you don't wanna take the plowing question? No, I'm good with that.
[Tim McGivern]: We adapt to these scenarios. A lot of times, if they're movable, we may move them out of the way if they're in the way of plowing. It's not that big of a deal. When it gets to the level of bolted down bollards, we try to keep them and avoid them. We try not to build snow piles that will block sight lines at stop signs. If we're doing that, we're doing something wrong anyway. making sure that pedestrian ramps are clear at crossings and bus stops, that's a problem too. So if you see any of that, as usual, just give us a call during the storm or after the storm and we try to respond to those things immediately.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Mary, you got it again.
[SPEAKER_23]: Yes, I do. Thank you very much for it. Just as a reminder, when you're talking about that, Those people that live on Woobin Street, they all end up parking on Osborne Road because they can't park on Woobin Street and they don't have enough driveway space to facilitate for their own cars. So you're going to have all those added ones on that one area of Osborne Road because it's you know, odd and even years. So that's just another, I mean, these are just things that, having lived there since 1968, these are things that we have to look at, and I wanna just make sure that you're aware of them. Woburn Street, it's a bad situation. Woburn and Places, it's a bad situation. But moving it up 15 feet, I'm not sure is going to make them stop any more than keeping it back where it was. on moving straight. They're not stopping. They're not stopping, it's a fact. So those are the near misses that you're hearing about and people are complaining about. That happens all the time.
[Todd Blake]: It seems like there's a lot of other people on the call. I'm not sure if they're here for Pearl Street or this, but maybe we should at least get to everyone at least once maybe if there's others.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Absolutely. If there's anybody else that has a comment or concern about Osborne, please raise your hand or comments. We've left the, everybody that's raised their hand, I think we've gotten to. So I'm assuming that everybody else that's still here is for, that's the only other item we have, but if you do have comments or concerns with this street and you'd like to speak about it, please either raise your hand or add into the chat that you'd like to speak. Okay, seeing none, pass it back to the commissioners and I know there's a lot of, you know,
[Alicia Hunt]: I'm frankly surprised that there are residents who are against something that will make things that would try to get cars to slow down and to make things safer for cars, pedestrians and bicyclists. I think that these kinds of things are very important. It would be lovely if we could have some way of doing pretty barrels and stuff like that, rather than the barriers that people don't like the looks of. Because I think that something like this could really help that situation a lot. It looks pretty dangerous. I'm surprised that we're not being encouraged to just approve this at this time. Um, so I, I'm not really sure what to do with that. And I did just notice that there was one person who said, hi, I'm Janice. I would like to speak.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Um, Alicia, if you're all set up, I'll go to Janice and ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_23]: Hi. Can anybody hear me?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: We can. Good evening. We lost you now. Can you hear us? Janice, we're just going to ask you to unmute again. We were not able to hear you. It seems like you're having issues with your audio, so if you want to type it into the messages and one of us can read it, that's fine. just not be able to do it at this time. If you'd like to type your message or your comment or concern into the messages, we can read it for the forum here on record. She's probably typing, so she probably have it. She lives in the corner place that in Osborne, so. This point, I assume she's trying to type any other. Comments on it and come back to Janice. If no one else would like to make a comment on this, or are having issues raising your hand, you can make a comment here on the messages. Click on your, I'm asking you to unmute so you can get on record here. Seeing none, pass it back to the commissioners. And if Janice is able to put a message in there, I'll be sure. If there's any other comments or concerns on this, or if there was something set forth that the commissioners wanted to.
[Jim Silva]: Yeah, I would just like to say that there needs to be a review. If this is passed this evening, a review within a year to look at the data that has occurred, to look at the aesthetics, to see exactly how this needs to be put into place. This is something that has been an ongoing process from what I understand. So it's really important to affect some sort of change. And this might be the way to do this in a way that allows you again to collect data to see how it works and ultimately passes. So I will say that my perspective is with the caveat of a review in a year, that's something that's powerful.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. And to kind of piggyback off what Jim, uh, Commissioner Silva had said is it's, it's helpful that, that we hear feedback from the residents. along with the data that we collect. If we're not getting feedback, whether it's a crosswalk issue or a crosswalk violation, or if a bicyclist had an issue, or if there was somebody's truck, all the data for us is sometimes we don't receive a collision or somebody doesn't call on a hit and run or something like that. So if there's an issue or something like that and the residents can bring it to our attention, I'm more than happy to put my email in the chat and somebody can email myself or Sergeant Rogers. And we're more than happy to keep a running log here for any issues that we come across along with, we have see click fix and the speeding on place that road. We isn't probably one of the number one streets that we receive speeding complaints for. We've had our traffic unit and or field training officers out there and. Dealing with the, the.
[Jim Silva]: This meeting, but if I could add something to this, there is a state of Massachusetts maintains the intersection accident list as well. If I Google it, I'm sure I can find it. And there is statistics from the last probably 15 years available. So, if you look specifically in this corner, oftentimes that information is captured and it is available through the state government and Southern Transportation Department. but I will be happy to provide that information if somebody, I put my email in the chat and I'll be able to send it to you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you. Yeah, I did a quick search. We had two collisions here going back to 2021. I was not able to look up the date, but I know that I personally responded to a bicyclist collision here. but I'm not exactly sure on the date. I know it was in the past two years, but I can find that if I had some more time to kind of get the report.
[Tim McGivern]: I think this is a great discussion about data, but this particular situation, and a lot of situations, this is one of those worlds of engineering that's a lot of art. Like I was mentioning before, the standard of care doesn't really involve data here. It would be nice though, just because of the design of the intersection, and I think You know, when you look at these older intersections that are basically horse paths that were turned into roads and these large swaths of pavement, it's pretty objective in the engineering community that that's a problematic intersection. We need to fix it. So that's the 1st thing. But I do love data and we should have a plan for a pilot and how we measure it. And that's all great. And then to piggyback on that point even more. There's this idea in traffic management, Todd can talk more about it. It's not just about data and the rigidness of the regulations, but it's also about how people feel. Because when people feel safe, they don't do unexpected things out on the road, which reduces conflict. So sometimes traffic engineers do things just because it feels safer. So there is elements of that in this project as well, for sure. So I just wanted to put that out there because I know there's a big need for data. People love talking about data. They want data driven results. But sometimes in this world, it's not about the data. It's just about that's a terrible design from way long time ago and we need to fix it. So thank you. I'm in favor of this, by the way, and I would vote in favor of this tonight as an interim with a 1 year check in period that any data that we collected would be great. And any feedback from public officials such as Todd MPD. Anybody else. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Is that a motion? If anybody else doesn't have any comments?
[Tim McGivern]: No, just my opinion as a commissioner. You know, I know that not all commissioners have spoken on it, so.
[Todd Blake]: Tim, thank you for those comments, because I can think of so many examples in Medford and elsewhere in the Boston region that fit into what you described. For instance, the Dayford School project for the Robert School across Fellsway West, and there's not necessarily data showing pedestrians who get hit on Fellsway West because they're too scared to cross the street. So we're working with the state to improve those crossings, make them safer so that people feel encouraged and safe to do so and encourage more people to walk versus drive to and from school. So there's many instances where the data won't necessarily support what people want or what we know is the right thing to do. But we aren't opposed to data. It just may not bear out the way people think it does.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Great. I'm sure if there's, or I'll pass it back to the public if there's no other comments or concerns that somebody would like to voice, push it back to the commissioners to table or make a motion.
[Tim McGivern]: I would rather someone else motion this just because Todd's in the DPW.
[Alicia Hunt]: I'll motion to approve it with a one-year review period.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'll second it. Roll call, Alba.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Excuse me, Commissioner McGibbon?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt? Yes. Commissioner Silva?
[Jim Silva]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Covino?
[Paul Covino]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: One absent. Forming the affirmative, one absent, the voting passes.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay, thank you everybody for your comments and concern on that. Thank you. I think the table item was Pearl Street and I'm just going to look here. I'm not doing that.
[Alicia Hunt]: I'm also, I just want to say, I also want to take a different tabled item off. I'd like the commission to discuss the commercial parking policy. And I just to caveat that not with the intention of voting tonight, but if we could review the proposal with the idea that maybe then we could advertise the proposal with the thought of voting on it at a future meeting. But I thought we could at least have a preliminary conversation on it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: On the commercial one, I'd like to add with that, kind of with Sarah speaking on the $40 violation to kind of go in with that, be moved to 72 hours, but sure.
[Alicia Hunt]: I think Pearl Street, since the other- Obviously, I'll move to take Pearl Street off the table.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'm not sure what the number is.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Can you see it? It is 2025.55. Thank you. So, Mr. Harmon, it moves to 2025.55 out of the table of business.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: And seconded by Jim. I'll second that. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.
[Alicia Hunt]: Sorry, Todd is just going to see if he has internet back at his computer to be able to share the Pearl Street. Oh, I have what he, he sent stuff to Alva who scanned it in and I have it in black and white on my computer I can share. I don't have his originals.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: If I could just start off, I have been watching Pearl Street. I have been down there, I have tagged, I have talked to the neighbors, and it's been a sharp decrease in parking on the sidewalk since we have been enforcing. About blocking traffic, are they blocking traffic?
[Paul Covino]: Are they parking on the opposite side? No, not that I've come upon. I think we should wait for Todd's demonstration. Look like you're ready, Todd.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Do I get to get you to co-host again? I did. Should be all set, Todd.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, thanks. Yeah, I seem to be connected now in my office again. Sorry for that. So this graphic, can you all see that? It kind of shows parking.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: You might need to scroll in a little bit, Todd. That's a little bit small if you can.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, for some reason, I'm still having computer issues. It's not allowing me to do that. I'm lucky I have this work. So sorry for that. I looked into the north side versus the south side, if we chose which side would result in more parking. And it looked to me, minusing the corners and the hydrants, that it's about equal. I believe we fit about 24 cars on all the north side or all the south side. Then I looked at alternating, which again, it's meant to maximize parking, but also vary which side of the street. And also it has a traffic calming effect to alternate. The traveling would have to weave through the cars and it may simulate what's actually happening there today anyways. So by alternating, it looks like we're able to have 26 parking spaces. So I think alternating In terms of parking, maximization of parking spaces does yield the most, 26 versus 24, so two as compared to just north or just south. So I know it's difficult to see. Sorry for that. So if parking start on the north side as you come off College Avenue and then switches to the south side, then back to the north side, then back to the south side, it would yield two extra spaces. I have another graphic, but I'm not sure I can get that up. This just, it's not allowing me to increase for some reason. But basically, I could share this. It just alternates parking, and there would potentially be just an edge line of paint guiding the traveling public around the parked cars. That's an option to have the paint or not. But I think it's helpful because it may help prevent, if the parking does alternate, it will help a vehicle from potentially rear-ending the first in the string of cars. So that's what we had looked at since the last meeting to try it and it seems like Chief, it seems like this would basically replicate what may be happening today. As you said, if they park in the street on the non-parking side instead of on the sidewalk, then a car can't park opposing it or otherwise it would block the road. This just establishes that for people to know where that would occur and it would establish it for the parking officers and the police officers who may have to enforce parking. because otherwise you may not know if there's a car parked opposite each other who is there first and who is contributing to that issue of blocking the road. So by formalizing it, you could do something like this, just throwing it out there as an option. Hopefully that helps the discussion.
[Tim McGivern]: Two different scenarios.
[Todd Blake]: What's that?
[Tim McGivern]: Were those two different, or was the second one the line with the first one?
[Todd Blake]: The first one was just to show different colors of where the space is, how it lays out with the three different options. So the second graphic was just, in my opinion, the preferred option, which is alternating, because it maximizes the parking spaces and has the traffic calming benefits.
[Tim McGivern]: Does that involve edge lines or marking out L's and T's?
[Todd Blake]: So it would involve, in my opinion, it would involve signs where the transition occurs from no parking to parking allowed with an arrow. So an arrow to the no parking sign, an arrow to the parking. And then it would clearly define which several spaces of parking is allowed and which is not allowed. And then you could also add the, one white line on the right and one yellow line on the left to guide the motoring public to help avoid hitting the first in the string of a set of three or four parked cars. That first one on that odd side has the potential for a vehicle to collide with the back side of it if it doesn't have markings.
[Tim McGivern]: I think so, a parallel set of yellow, white line.
[Todd Blake]: But not necessarily L's and T's individually. Right. Just edge line, yeah.
[Tim McGivern]: An edge line and a yellow, and the edge line and yellow would meander down the street. Correct. And you'd get parking staggered.
[Todd Blake]: So the signs would help people know where they should park and where they shouldn't, and the enforcement officers, and then the lines are more for the motoring public to guide them. Yeah, even though as you said before we don't necessarily want to get in the habit of painting every single side street But in this case, I think the hitch line would help.
[Tim McGivern]: I think you're right And it could be people get used to it and we let it fade I
[Todd Blake]: Correct, yeah. Or, given last conversation, we could consider one cone at the backside. So in other scenes that have done the slalom with curving, usually if the front or the front edge of that first car would usually be a curved bump out with a sign with a yellow arrow. So a cheap way of doing that would be one flex post in that area. But it seems like
[Tim McGivern]: Folks maybe slow street should be anyway. And then I would be interested if there are residents here to speak, I would be interested in knowing how fast people drive down the street normally. I mean, it seems like 1 of those streets that hopefully people creep down pretty slow. So they're not hitting cars.
[Todd Blake]: I believe either DPW or police, we have a radar feedback sign on Pearl, so we could pull some data for that as well. In this case, we do have data.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: The police department does not have one on Pearl.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, DPW does, so we could pull data off that. But as some of us know, the fact that the signs there could impact people slow down, which is a good thing, but then the data won't necessarily reflect what they were doing before we had that sign.
[Tim McGivern]: So if we do chicanes, they're going to have to slow down? Are they going to hit cars?
[Todd Blake]: Correct, yeah.
[Tim McGivern]: I like the chicane idea.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Okay. There's any residents like to speak on it? Unless commissioners have anything else to input, I'd move it to the public. Seeing none, I will go. Diane, I'm just gonna ask you on mute. You may have come off here. Diane, if you are having issues, just ask you to unmute. We'll come back to you. We'll go to Lori. Just ask you to unmute, and then Diane, we'll come back to you. Lori, good evening. How are you?
[SPEAKER_10]: Hi, good. How are you?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Good.
[SPEAKER_10]: OK, so the staggered parking would only add two more cars to the street? Did I understand that correctly?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_10]: Todd, I know my husband had talked to you about the sidewalk, painting a footstrip along the sidewalk edge to delineate the boundary between the sidewalk and the street. Is that at all a possibility?
[Todd Blake]: It's not something typically done. It wouldn't necessarily address the maintenance and longevity of sidewalk deterioration. I had suggested if, you know, I believed, I can speak for the members of this commission, but I believe for the city or any commission to consider that type of solution, you know, we'd have to have very strong evidence just to even consider it from say, the Disability Commission of Medford or the State Disability Commission, because if those types of agencies said, oh, we're okay with that type of scenario, but it still, again, doesn't address the longevity and maintenance issues related to cars, parking on sidewalks. But in terms of the accessibility piece, I think it's highly unlikely that they would support it, but that's, in my opinion, could contribute to making these decisions at a meeting like this for folks. But I don't know if you or your husband had a chance to reach out to those types of agencies regarding accessibility. But again, it would only, of the two issues we're pointing out, it would only really, even if that were the case, it would only really comment on one of the two. The deterioration, I know a lot of folks said before, Los Alamos was fine. But we know as an industry and engineers, in Medford and elsewhere that those things do contribute, because the depth of a sidewalk concrete is much less than at a driveway or a street depth. So we know that it's designed for a certain load, pedestrian load versus car load. So even if it's not apparent right now today on a particular sidewalk panel, we know that it does exist and affects the city, and not just Medford, other cities and towns and state. And then going back to your suggestion about the line on the sidewalk again, there is a state rule of no parking on sidewalks. And then there's, you know, so it would be still going against that. So the commission, in my opinion, has to weigh all those things.
[SPEAKER_10]: Right. But it would be saying that this is the street, this is the sidewalk. I mean, they're, uh, I believe eight and a half, um, feet. which is much wider than most sidewalks in the city.
[Todd Blake]: I did, yeah, to back you up, Lori, I did say, I looked into the sidewalk widths on all the neighboring streets, like Stern, Stanley, and others in the area of Frederick. And for whatever reason, I can't answer for whoever designed this neighborhood back in the 50s or whenever it was, but for whatever reason, the sidewalks on Pearl are a little wider than some of the other, say, Frederick and some others. And the street is more narrow for some reason. So again, that would be a major capital project to change that. And then I think people voice their opinions on that in the past about whether the dollars that we have to go throughout the city would be well spent on something like that to widen the streets, to provide more parking or to provide trees or whatnot. Those are decisions too that would still have to be made. And as you patiently waited during those other conversations, you heard that you know, my constant comments about capital improvements in resources, needs exceeding resources. So there's a long list of people waiting in line for curbing and concrete for various things. Right.
[SPEAKER_10]: So no, I understand that. And that's why I said maybe this could be a temporary thing until eventually there's funding, because the sidewalks that aren't being used for parking They seem to be more, um, destroyed than where the cars are parked, but I don't know if I think the staggered parking would help with the speeding. And yes, there are a lot of speeding cars that go down Pearl street because it's a cut through. Um, but to get two cars, I mean, my opinion. I mean, I'm not happy, I'm not happy with the whole thing of it. You know, it's just, it goes just far beyond inconvenience of parking in front of your own house. It's, you know, your quality of life, like your guests, there's just nowhere to park there if you can't have the two sides. You know, you're talking about asking people when you have a holiday or a family dinner to go find parking on side streets that you're going to inconvenience or take away from someone else's parking. And never mind the students that aren't even here yet. The street is pretty full. And we have a lot of vacant two-family homes, which include students when they come here. And this is the summer, and the summer it's a little easier, but the winter, it's gonna be a really big hardship. And I know you're trying to work on it, but I don't know what else to do, to say. I mean, I had a drop, I had a car full of groceries, and I had to, I did park on the sidewalk so I could unload my car, because I had nowhere to go. son had a guest at the house, so my driveway was taken, unbeknownst to me that that was going to happen. It's just, it's hard. And then to boot, you're adding the cost of the permit pricing. It's going to cost me $160 without guest parking stickers, and I won't even be able to park in my own street.
[Todd Blake]: May I ask how it's been going since the last meeting? So the chief had proposed since the last meeting until now that allow parking on both sides, just not directly opposite each other. How has that been working out?
[SPEAKER_10]: I have seen down the lower end when you're taking off of College Ave, I know a few cars there have parked staggered. And it seemed to work. No one up in my area or I'm closer to Main Street. I haven't seen anyone do that there.
[Todd Blake]: So the reason I ask, and maybe the commissioners are thinking, because if it seems to be working out, again, I'll just like the proposal to alternate would be to formalize essentially the same thing. You wouldn't be able to park directly opposite each other, but at least it would inform people where to do that and how to do it. And the people enforcing it, who is, you know, they wouldn't have to figure out who is there first. Right.
[SPEAKER_10]: And that's just adding two more parking spaces.
[Todd Blake]: And like I said, we don't- Unfortunately, that's the way the math worked out. But I think historically, I don't know about the police department, but historically, I may have seen maybe three to five cars parking on the side of Pearl, roughly, so say three or four.
[SPEAKER_10]: On the sidewalk?
[Todd Blake]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_10]: There's probably about six or eight.
[Todd Blake]: Okay.
[SPEAKER_10]: On a normal day.
[Todd Blake]: So of those six or eight, where by alternating officially would be accommodating two of them in the worst case, then if it's six or eight, those four others, some of them may compete on the other streets. But are we talking the worst case scenario? So for parking in general, like at a mall, say, for instance, a mall parking lot isn't supposed to be designed. I know this is not a mall, it's a street, but the point I'm making is you don't design it for a Christmas rush, but then 90% of the other year, like the parking lot's half vacant. So that's a trend nowadays too. You don't design for the worst case scenario, you design for the, you know, the 85th percentile or some percentage of what mostly occurs. And then those few times where it's so full, you might have to walk a little further. But to account for like the worst case scenario all the time isn't necessarily the way to go for other treatments these days anyway. So I understand. I totally hear what you're saying in terms of what impacts it will have. But I think the G zone does help as compared to if this was proposed when there was no G zone. because you would only be limited to Pearl Street. So if you didn't fit on Pearl, you'd only be able to go to non-restricted streets like Main. So by having the zone, it does open up the option to Stearns or Stanley, even though the likelihood of using them won't be often, but it does open up more streets than what would have been if this came about before the zone was there.
[SPEAKER_10]: Right. Right, it would go both ways. Being in the G zone, yes, you could have possibly more people there. And yes, we could go to other locations. But again, this is a good time of year when the students aren't around. You add the students into this, and it's very challenging.
[Todd Blake]: I think we have another.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Just to clarify that, a student shouldn't be able to get parking passes unless their vehicles are registered to the address in Medford. If there's an out-of-state plate that's parked on a street in Medford, I'm just using that as an example for a tough student, then they do not have a parking pass.
[Todd Blake]: So in the chat, Liberta's iPad wants to speak, and also Diane has her hand up.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Diane, Liberta. but just wanted to make sure that he didn't have anything else.
[SPEAKER_10]: No, no, thank you though.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Diane, we're going to go back to you and just ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_13]: Hi, thank you. I just kind of wanted to reinforce what Laurie was stating. Our street right now, if you look at it at night, even during the day, it's pretty crowded, but there's many apartments that are vacant right now. And I know you said that the students, if they have out of state plates, but a lot of them, in fact, my student, my son goes to school in a different city and he has parking you know, at that place on the street. And I know a lot of the residents here will get permit stickers because they'll have an apartment and they'll have it year round. So that makes them a resident. And if they don't do that, I know a lot of states they'll use a visitor's pass and they'll park there. So that is an issue. And right now our street is full. Not our main season. It doesn't matter that it's Christmas. This is just our regular normal season. Some of it is our late season. And the other thing you asked about, questions on how this has been going. Lori, I think you are away, but there was a car down at the beginning of Pearl Street that was parked, they were parked on both sides of the street. And the mirror was ripped off a few weeks ago, in front of the new apartment at the new building down the street that they have for sale. The side view mirror was ripped off when it was parked on Pearl Street. a few weeks ago. And then also one of the trash trucks couldn't get down the street because they were parked on both sides of the street again. So they were leaning on their horn trying to get down the street to get the car to move. So I just, I don't know if Stagger Parking is gonna do the trick because I don't know if people are gonna, I know you said you're gonna mark it, but what happens when there's snow on the ground? What happens if, I don't know. I just, I don't know what's gonna work. It's going to be an issue and a hardship for everybody who lives on the street. I know Laurie had said about, I thought Skip had a great idea when he had said to mock the sidewalk. If the sidewalks you need technically, you need five feet, I think was said for a sidewalk width and the sidewalks eight feet or whatever it is. Why can't you use a couple of feet to park on if you drove a line and if cars parked over the line? then you ticket them or tow them. Why can't that be used if the sidewalk's big enough? What's the concern? Why are we changing?
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Diane, in state law, you cannot park on a sidewalk.
[SPEAKER_13]: But what if the sidewalk's already larger than it needs to be?
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: It doesn't matter. It's a sidewalk.
[SPEAKER_13]: So what's the difference between making the sidewalk smaller, legit smaller, and drawing a line to save money?
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: That's what they would have to do is remove the curb, Go in two feet, dig it out, and put the curving in.
[Tim McGivern]: And then pointy sidewalks.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: As long as you're compliant with ADA.
[SPEAKER_13]: Right. Right. But so even if it's wide enough, it still wouldn't be compliant. If you're saying this is the sidewalk, per se, you can't do it that way to save money.
[Tim McGivern]: No, I think one of the problems here is that there never has been these parking spaces that folks are relying on. So we understand, I think. I can only speak for myself here, but I empathize for your situation. These spaces never really existed. The chicane option does add two legit spaces from one side only. So that is helpful. The chicane option leaves parking on both sides just staggered. You know, I'm really glad we waited this month and gave Todd some time to think about this as the city's professional in this world. And, you know, but, you know, I think I understand what you guys have for hardships because maybe of this decision, but also don't forget. You have a hardship now that's potentially preventing public safety from getting to you when you need it. Diane, you described a mirror getting hit. As soon as you start hearing about mirrors getting hit, that means the cars are too close together. As soon as a fire truck can't get through, an ambulance can't get through, or there's a traffic jam, it just creates public safety problems for you and for people downstream of you on the road. So that's why it's important for us to deal with this, but we have to deal with it in a way where, as the chief said last time, we should deal with it in a way that is understanding of your situation. And I think what Todd has struck here, in my opinion, does strike that balance for what it's worth. So thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Loretta, I will go to you and just ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_21]: Hi. I worked here for 55 years. We've never had an issue with basically the parking situation. Everything has always been fine. I know some people do have to park on the sidewalk a little, I'm just not sure all of a sudden, when did this become an issue? For 55 years, it wasn't an issue that some cars did have to pull up. And honestly, it's, of course, not our fault that the street wasn't made correctly and the sidewalks weren't made four feet instead of the eight feet that they are. So I feel as though we're being penalized. I have no idea. I'm honestly not understanding this new parking, but all I can see is that I'm not gonna be able to have anyone come and visit me anymore. Me at my age, I'm 76, and my friends or whatever are my age or older, I can't expect them to go find parking on other streets in order to come visit me. I don't know if you really realize the hardship that you are creating by doing this. I really don't know what to say. I mean, it's just not making common sense to me. I mean, I know there is that law that you're not supposed to park on the sidewalk, but it's something that people have been doing. There aren't that many cars that need to do it.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Roberta, I'm Sergeant Rogers. I monitor the C-Click fix in the city. And I have received numerous, numerous complaints from residents. Why are you not doing anything? Why are you allowing this? I'm handicapped. I cannot get by. So I think it finally came to a head.
[SPEAKER_21]: Okay, but again, I also have a handicap and I can tell you that I can get my Walker out there when I need to use it. And I can walk on the sidewalk if there's a car there, I believe as far as. any type of obstructed path of travel. I think it has to be at least three feet. And because of the size of the sidewalks and the cars don't go totally on the sidewalk, they're just going up a little to make enough room. There's plenty of room for me to get by with my walker plus people walking alongside of me if I need it.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Roberta, I have cars that are parking on the curb and I'm still getting complaints.
[Tim McGivern]: Um, you cannot park on the sidewalk from a public work standpoint to liberate. I know we're trying to explain this before and, you know, thank you for your patience and try to understand this. Um, but it, the sidewalks are not designed for that. They're not meant for it. There's all kinds of issues with federal law, state law and municipal law, like, all the way up the chain. So when we're getting complaints, as Sergeant Rogers is describing, and it comes to our attention, and we monitor the situation, we've identified, even though it hasn't happened yet, we don't want it to happen, a situation where vehicle, emergency vehicles can't get down the road because you have cars parked properly on both sides. If someone's trying to follow the law, and someone's coming to visit you or your neighbors, and they want to legally park on that street today, and someone across the street wants to do the same thing, they can create a situation where They have now made the road impassable. So that we can't allow that to happen. So that's the reasoning behind all of this. And we have an option on the table that is strikes a balance between the needs of the resident on the street and what you've been experiencing for the last. Decade or more you more than others. So, you know, hopefully that provides some information for you to understand to further understand what we're doing here and why we're doing it.
[Todd Blake]: So, yeah, I would like to add to that. Thank you. I'd like to add. that, you know, we're human, we get it, it seems all of a sudden, it seems out of the blue. But for us, or people in the city, and the people complaining, it's not out of the blue, they've been asking for this for years. So, you know, over the past so many years, Medford's been trying to do the right thing, clean up some things that may have been done incorrectly. Like one, for instance, is parking in the same direction or travel. You know, that was something that was, widespread in Medford and when we had to kind of re-teach everyone how to park in their proper direction of travel. That's also a common thing statewide in other cities and towns. It's just in Medford for whatever reason it was a long time. So we're trying to slowly respond to people that know the rules that have been in other communities that know the rules well and constantly get in contact with all of us professionals that work for the city to do the right thing and get people off the sidewalks. And so you know Hopefully you don't feel like it's targeting Pearl Street in particular because there are other streets that this has occurred and we've already addressed some of those. Harvard Street was one, Park Street is another, Arlington Street is another. So it's not just Pearl Street, just so you know, it's other streets as well. So we're systematically trying to go through piece by piece to clean this stuff up and we do realize it's a change for folks. But we have a responsibility to look at that side of things, the state law, and the complaints about it as well. So Arlington Street is a perfect example of a whole block that lost a whole side of parking. We had the same discussion. So it's not just Pearl Street. I know it probably feels that way. So I just wanted to let you know as well that it's not.
[SPEAKER_21]: Could I ask one other question? I heard Laurie talk about zoning and different permits. I'm not aware of any of that. Could someone explain that to me? How much is it going to cost me to park on my own street now?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Jim, if you want to step in and give exact numbers, that might be.
[Sarah McDermod]: So, it was the question, how much does it cost to park on the street?
[Paul Covino]: Well, explain the zone. She doesn't understand it.
[Sarah McDermod]: Oh, the G zone is a zoned area. So Pearl street is part of the G zone. There is information. I don't know if you have access to the city's website, but we've got a whole section on the parking parking page about the G zone. And. It allows people who live in the G zone to park on with their permit on their card. They're allowed to park on any street within the G zone. The only thing that doesn't transfer to other streets is your visitor passes. I know I think Lori mentioned having visitors over those visitor passes that any of you might have are only good on Pearl street, but your own personal vehicles that you have paid for a permit for are allowed on any street in the G zone. And if you give me a second, I can look at the map and give you some streets that are close by.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, I can help while you pull up the maps there. So Stern Stanley, Credrick, Windsor, all these streets, Bowdoin, Princeton, Yale. Harvard so any pretty much it encompasses a lot of streets in the South Medford kind of hillside area That it's approximately a certain distance away from the Green Line is what the zone was created But it's resident districts parking just as other communities you may have seen it and elsewhere like Boston and others have districts so like Beacon Hill in Boston you could park on any one Beacon Hill, but not South Boston and vice versa and So this was, so South Medford in your area was a pilot that became permanent to have a zoned parking situation. So you're not just restricted to Pearl Street, which is what it used to be. So you used to only be able to, with your sticker or permit, park on Pearl Street only, even non-visitor. But that was expanded to allow you to park on neighboring streets as well, if they're posted within that zone. There's a green G on the parking sign.
[SPEAKER_21]: Okay, is that in addition to my parking permit that I need to pack on Pearl Street? Because it's permit only parking?
[Sarah McDermod]: The permit you have for Pearl Street applies to any street in the G zone. So, let's say you get to pro street, it's full. You can go over to Stearns Avenue. You can go over to wedge mirror. You could go to Stanley. There are some non permitted streets on the other side of George street as well. So, like, Royal street, and I believe it's Florence street. Those don't have permits at all. So anybody can park there, whether or not they have a permit. So also Dwyer circles a little farther, but there are other options for. you and or your guests should Pearl Street fill up. Now, I know you said you had a handicap that might impair your ability to walk, but this could also apply to your guests, people who wanna come see you. So that's just something to keep in mind.
[SPEAKER_21]: Okay, I'm sorry. I thought they just said though that the guest passes are only good for Pearl Street. They can't use them on those other streets.
[Sarah McDermod]: Well, right. I just, I wanted to put that out there for anybody from Pearl Street who's listening, not specifically for you. But yeah, so if people, Utilize the entire G zone residents end up on other streets that might leave space available for permit parking. And then we also highly encourage people to use their driveways, either for themselves or for their guests. If you have a permit and move to this to the street, allow your guests in the driveway, then you can avoid buying having to buy a visitor permit. Anyway, although if you're over 65, any permits you purchase visitor or resident wouldn't cost you anything.
[SPEAKER_21]: Okay, like we have a common driveway. So even though it looks as though it's long, people can't use it because it's common. We have to allow both families able to get out. So that would stop any visitors from being able to park in it. So I'm still not sure with all of this where visitors are going to go because I don't foresee other people if they're coming home and there's a space on the street, they're going to park on the street. They're not going to say, let me go around to Stanley or someplace else so that I can free up a spot for someone that might have a visitor tonight.
[Sarah McDermod]: So, well, but if you do that, if somebody does that, they could then move their car to somewhere else in the G zone and allow their guests to park in front of their home. There's, I mean, I'm happy to go over the any options with you liberta. I'm like, info's on the website or I can send it to you in it.
[SPEAKER_21]: Yeah, I'm getting I understand what you're saying. It's just not something that I think is, you know, going to work to our advantage. Let me put it that way.
[Sarah McDermod]: So, yeah, I mean, unfortunately, if we allowed, it's just, we can't allow the sidewalk anymore. If I let if, I mean, if, even if they could allow Pearl street to do it, then it opens other streets wanting to do it too. But I know that's not even it's not even it's kind of a hard stop on that because it's a state law. We can't just.
[SPEAKER_21]: Yeah.
[Sarah McDermod]: you know, unfortunately.
[SPEAKER_21]: Hopefully you can get on a list for new sidewalks at some point. It's a shame because they put new sidewalks in across the way, not that many years ago. I don't know why they didn't take the opportunity then to make them the correct size. Then we probably wouldn't even have to have this meeting.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you, Roberta. Thank you. Just want to see if anybody else in the public would like to speak. Seeing none here. If you are having issues raising your hand, just add into the comments. If not, I will pass it back to the commissioners.
[Jim Silva]: I'd just like to say that I think it's a great option. It resolves the issue with parking on the sidewalk, which again is illegal. But also I think as the neighbors alluded to, it's an opportunity to slow the traffic down potentially as everyone who drives there knows that it is a shortcut for George Street. So again.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you. Diane, I'll just ask you to unmute me. should be held. Good evening.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi. I just want to say that I agree with my neighbors who have just talked before me. I am a resident of this Pearl Street for 57 years. I beat out Liberta. And my husband and I have been here 57 years. We're 82, 83 years of age. Fortunately, we don't have too many problems with our mobility, but who's to say? We do have a driveway and we have loaned it to neighbors when they've had parties. But right now, I am in agreement with all my neighbors about this whole parking situation. It's been even inconvenience for me with the driveway because I have a tree service that comes periodically to do my 200-year-old oak in my back tree. He likes to park in front of my house somewhat and bring his long hose in, and he couldn't do it a few weeks ago. He had to come back a couple of weeks later when they were able to find a parking space, because some of my neighbors had moved their cars or whatever. And being on the odd side of the street, which is where all the cars are parked, He couldn't pack across the street to bring this long hose and because it would have been right in the way of traffic for cars coming down the street. So there's another issue with any type of service trucks. They're going to come by. I had this particular instance happened right away within 2 weeks of. the traffic commission saying that we had to park on one side. Those are something I wouldn't even been thinking about until it happened. It's something to consider also. I know we cannot park on the sidewalk. It's a law, it's a federal law, it's a state law, a city law, whatever, but we've been doing it for years. hasn't seemed to really hurt anyone, even the traffic. Someone from the traffic unit mentioned that traffic emergency vehicles couldn't get down. Well, we've had a few emergency vehicles on the street, and they seem to get down here very fine with their police cars, fire trucks, whatever. We had one here just a couple of years ago. LaVerita can attest to that, when her husband was sick. I don't think that's really the main issue. I think most people, when they park on the sidewalk, they park far enough on the sidewalk to give the street the width that these emergency trucks do need. Maybe if we could park on the sidewalk, you could tell everyone, you have to park this far up to make the street wide enough for emergency vehicles. Maybe you can allow us to do that. It's just something to consider because I am not happy about this whole situation either. And thank you for listening. Thank you.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Anybody else in the public? If you have any comments, just raise your hand or type in the chat. Pass it back to the commissioners. Can I say something?
[Paul Covino]: Chief Covino, I just want to say to the residents down there, gone is the day when the chief of police could say, don't worry about it, park on the sidewalk, you won't get tagged. So, you know, that is out of the question for us now. And what many of you don't know, as Sergeant Rogers said, we received many complaints about cars being parked on the sidewalk. Whether they're legitimate complaints about not being able to get by or not, we're not there to judge that. But the law does say we can't park on the sidewalks. those people that are hindered by it in some way have a valid complaint even though As you say, there is space there. And as Mr. McGiven would tell you, there's eventually going to be a problem with the deterioration of those sidewalks with cars parking on them. And I know you've been doing it a long time, and some areas have deterioration, some areas don't. But that is a true fact. But I know last week, I mean, last month, I spoke up to try to give us some time. And we were told back then it was usually four or five cars parked on the sidewalk. Okay, we did our due diligence. We worked hard. Mr. Blake did a lot of work along with Sergeant Canava about measuring spaces and counting spaces. They've come up with a maximum number that will give us two more than just saying, okay, you can park on one side or the other. all the chances of us saying, okay, park on that sidewalk, even if we put a stripe on it, too, is not going to happen. And I'm sorry for that. But the the fact is that we've come to a time where, unless more people want to speak about this from the public, that's fine. But we have come to a time where we're getting ready to vote on this. And I just wanted to say that, you know, in years past when Chief was able to say don't worry about it most certainly can't be done in today's day and age and we do have to address the issues the legitimate complaints that may not seem legitimate to you who are residents there but they are legitimate to people other people who live there that are not speaking and other people that traverse up and down that street so now our goal is to was to try and give us maximum parking on that street. And I think Mr. Blake's plan with staggered parking does do that. And secondly, it slows down what we learned at last month's meeting that there was many people speeding up down that street. So it would slow down traffic as well and allow everybody to get by safely. And I know there are two conversations going here, it seems. And many of you are saying, no, there's never a problem with emergency vehicles getting down the street. But that is because cars were parked on one side and cars on the other side were on the sidewalk and unfortunately it's been put upon us to have to eliminate that parking on the sidewalk situation and I think you know we've come up with the best plan possible here until somehow the city can get money to Cut curbs in so we can add more parking on one side, but we don't have it right now. And, you know, that's something that, you know, maybe in the future of someday we'll be on a list of those types of enhancements and we'll get there. So.
[Tim McGivern]: It's not off the table, chief. It's not off the table, but I'll tell you, this part of Medford has a lot of pavement and one of the issues that we have in front of us is like heat island effect and also stormwater issues. So there's a lot of benefits to the city to look at streets like this one and figure out what the sidewalk should be, put the curb in the proper place, as I kind of alluded to last time. So it's definitely not off the table. But in the meantime, we obviously have to follow the law. Right. And I know about this and it's one of those things. It will go on a list and we know about it. We just can't promise anything in the relative near future.
[Paul Covino]: Thank you. I appreciate that. And I apologize for the last situation with Osborne Road where I didn't have the proper information as far as data goes. But again, that's another scenario where we have to make the best decision possible today or soon to make things safer for the public until we can come up with a more permanent solution.
[Tim McGivern]: So thank you. Yeah, I don't like motioning. I would motion, but I don't like motioning on when Todd brings stuff to the table. But I would support this for sure.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: We just have two more people from the public. Back to the commissioners, just asking you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_07]: Hello. Mark, good evening. Good evening. Yes, I'd like to also speak up. Since they not parking on both sides, it's been like a speedway here. We have one of those speed things, and it's red all the time. People are flying down the street. And speed has been a problem on this street in the 45 years I've lived here. But I think the side-to-side staggered parking, I hope it would help.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Look, the studies show that, you know, Nothing in speeding and enforcement is perfect, but staggered parking, the studies show that it does slow vehicles down due to their eyesight and vehicles being on each side. But nothing's perfect, and I know there'll be down times where vehicles won't be parked on either side and may open up some areas. Hopefully, that's the lower end of this. It should lower the speeds for vehicles traveling on this road.
[SPEAKER_07]: I certainly hope it helps.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Obviously. Diane, we'll go back to you as well to ask you to unmute.
[SPEAKER_13]: I just had a question. What happens in the winter when you're only allowed to park on one side of the street?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: the city starts obviously in which the year of the winter starts. So this year obviously it would be odd side parking. You're saying the other side just be completely eliminated?
[SPEAKER_13]: Right. Like are we going to have the whole street back again to park during the winter?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I mean, I would assume that.
[SPEAKER_13]: Then we're going to lose more parking on top of it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Well, you never had the parking there anyways. If we're parking on the odd side there for this, this winter, for an example, you would be able to park on the odd side and next year will be the even side, just like every other.
[SPEAKER_13]: Public way, but then, but, but so it hasn't changed, but the other time of the year, we can only pack in certain spots on on 1 side. So now, don't you think that's going to confuse people now? Because now, at certain times of the year, you can park on the whole side of the street, but on other times of the year, you can only pack on certain spots on that side of the street. I don't know. I just think that might be confusing.
[Tim McGivern]: That's all need the same. It'll be the same as what you experienced today. So odd or even during the winter, that's the side you park on. We plow straight line down your road against the other curb line. So that will stay the same.
[SPEAKER_13]: Right, but aren't you going to have signs saying no parking on certain spots on both sides?
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, yeah, but you're talking to the people that enforce those rules. So, during a snow emergency, you'd be allowed to park on 1 side because the reason that it's chicaned like that is to balance the idea of having availability for parking on both sides for residents. as well as the two spaces, that was nice, and slowing folks down. In the wintertime during a snow emergency, there's no reason to leave spaces between parked cars in that parking lane. So I'm sure the police would agree with me. We're trying to clear the snow, so we're gonna want Pearl Street to park on whatever the parking site is for that year.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: And we'll roll call that along with the city and if people need, no. If it's that we need. Go ahead.
[Alicia Hunt]: I can just remind people like, cause I remember the parking in Medford where it was the whole winter. You had to park on one side of the street. If I'll just remind everybody, it's not, it's literally from like a few hours around when the snow starts falling until a few hours after the snow stops falling. We're talking about, are these, are these windows of time? It's they're brief and they're just a couple in the winter time. It's not like, For months or anything, I get that. But when you live here, you have to deal with that.
[SPEAKER_13]: So it will concern us. It won't concern you.
[Tim McGivern]: Every single street has nuances, I assure you, and we do the best to listen to those nuances and take them into consideration, whether it's where the windrow is, a handicapped spot, issues with plucking sight lines with piles. Every single winter we deal with it, and I'm sure we can deal with your issues as well if they come up. Sorry, that's my kids.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Very good. If there are no other questions, I'll pass it back to the commissioners and.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, I don't want to motion. I'm trying to not motion first motion things on things that Todd brings, but I'm in support of this and we'll vote for it.
[Jim Silva]: I motion.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I'll second it. Seconded by Commissioner Hunt for second proposal here for additional parking, which would be two spots. You got that Alba? I'm not going to go to work forward. Okay.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner McGiven?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Commissioner Hunt? Yes. Commissioner Silva?
[Paul Covino]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: Chief Covino?
[Paul Covino]: Yes.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: One absent. 4 in the affirmative, 1 absent. The motion passes.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Well, I appreciate everybody's time and attendance here and. Sorry. Oh, Lori, I'll just going to ask you on mute.
[SPEAKER_10]: Hi, thank you. I just have a question. So, is this effective immediately and will you be painting? those parking spaces now, or is this just going to, how is this going to work?
[Todd Blake]: It takes some time. It looks like Tim may have hopped off. It takes some time from the meeting to when the meeting minutes get cleared and everything gets communicated to the right folks. So it's going to take some time. It's not going to be immediately tomorrow. And then likely, my understanding would be the signs would likely go up first to help delineate with arrows where it's allowed, where it's not. And then likely follow up with the paints. the paints a little more. It may involve third parties to schedule, whereas the signs are internal.
[SPEAKER_10]: Okay.
[Todd Blake]: So best guess would be like maybe a month or so.
[SPEAKER_10]: Okay. And can I just ask Tim a question? Tim, you said will possibly be put on a list. Can you make sure that Pearl Street would be on that list if the sidewalks are ever done over.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, I'll make sure that it's on a list somewhere. It might already be. There's a couple of streets out there where we know the curb line is kind of set wrong. This might be one of them. So I'll take a look at it, see what we have. And if it's not, I'll make sure that it is somewhere on the list. We did a whole survey of all of our sidewalks a number of years ago and have a large amount of data. So that's why I'm saying it that way. It most likely is categorized in a place where it should be. But I'll confirm that for you.
[SPEAKER_10]: Okay, thank you so much.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Yep. All right. Hey, Alicia, you wanted to take off? Thank you.
[MCM00001607_SPEAKER_07]: I'm just not seeing which number it is. 20-19-81. 20-19-81. The first one on table.
[Alicia Hunt]: It's actually 2019-81-81, commercial vehicle rules and regulations. I just want to point out to any members of the public who may be watching, the 2019 is the lead implies that this was an item that first went on this agenda in 2019. So motion to move this off the table to discuss this year.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: It's second.
[Alicia Hunt]: Oh, Tim needs to be made a co-host again, so he can unmute himself.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: OK. Thank you. Tim, you should be all set. Thanks. Yeah. OK, great. So we're pulling 2019-21 clarification for a product by the middle of January. So Alicia, the floor is yours.
[Alicia Hunt]: Yes so we had discussed this recently and we had asked to that we wanted we've gotten a lot of requests for commercial apartment parking and a lot of the requests seemed kind of reasonable but against the rules in Medford and the rules needed to be changed rather than us just starting to issue variances on this So we both asked Sarah if she could come up, Director McDermott, if she could come up with a proposal. And I had an intern do a bunch of research on other communities, what their rules were. And at this time, I can't remember if I circulated, I think I circulated that research to everybody, but I at least sent it to Sarah to use in her formulating of a proposal for us. And so my thought for this evening was to not put any undue pressure on anybody, but that we could discuss her proposal and if maybe we wanted to tweak it or whatever, but then to put it out to the public and ask the public to prepare to comment on it and to provide public comment on it possibly for our September meeting with the concept that maybe at that time we'd be prepared to vote. I actually think that this is something that has a lot of nuances to it. And so we absolutely need public comment and warning to the public that it's gonna be on the agenda. But I thought it would be helpful for us to sort of discuss it a little bit and see what, put something out for the public to consider. So that's my thought this evening. Um, if everybody's okay with that, then maybe, um, Sarah, I don't know if you make more sense for you to explain or present what you had proposed.
[Sarah McDermod]: Sure. I mean, I'm, I'm happy to do that. And Alicia, I'm, I'm pretty sure you did circulate that study to everybody, but even if you hadn't, I included it to in an email, um, when I sent this out on June 6th. So that was accessible to everybody. Um, So I don't do you want me to share my screen so you can just read the document. OK. So this is what I sent out. And honestly I have no commitment to any of these specific things. I base this entirely on what Alicia's intern found from other cities and what we've had seen for requests most recently since I started to allow some of those folks who've seemed like a reasonable requester to maybe get something for their vehicle. But what I propose, I'll make it a little bigger, is to allow for the sale of a permit for commercial vehicles meeting specific criteria. 1st vehicle registered garage address must be Medford that applies to all permits that we sell. Um, as far as resident to residents, a vehicle must be registered to the business. For which the, uh. Commercial plates. Proof of residence required of the permit requester. That would be the same threshold that we require for resident permits. Employer must verify in a company letterhead that the vehicle will be driven by the employee seeking the permit. Vehicle must fall within the vehicle size and marking requirements of the existing ordinance and limit one per household per single family home or per unit apartment or condo unit. But I also added a couple of questions whether this should. just be for overnight parking or for 24-7 parking because there are different rules during the daytime for commercial vehicles. One of the towns, maybe it might have been more than one, but at least one made the employer who owned the vehicle verify that the employee was the only one allowed to drive that car. That's something to consider as well if we want to implement that. So that's what I threw out there, and I'm not committed to any part of it.
[Alicia Hunt]: And can you clarify something? I'm making an assumption, and I want to check my assumption, if you don't mind. And that assumption is that one, because commercial vehicles are not allowed to park overnight anywhere in Medford, that this would be a permit that you may say live on a street that doesn't have permit parking, but you would still need a permit because it's a commercial vehicle, right? So that like you live up in North Medford, there's no permit parking in a lot of those streets, you would still need a permit to park overnight. If you had it, you wouldn't be ticketed. And the corollary to that is, are we envisioning that it would be on this street-by-street basis like we have for most of our residents, or would this just allow you to park it in Medford? Because I might imagine that you might one day park it at your business and one day park it at your home, or your home might be your business.
[Sarah McDermod]: I don't think I considered that. I mean, I didn't imagine them parking anybody who gets one of these parking outside of their own streets. But so yes to it being issued, or at least my intent was for it to be issued to anybody on any street, whether it's a permitted street or not. As long as obviously it's not a private way, we don't really, we can't really sell them permits. But as far as, Throughout the whole city, I don't think it's my intent was not to give them access to the whole city, just to their street, because the reasonable requests that we've received, or the ones I deemed reasonable wanted to park at their home. Overnight, not park in square, not part, but. If there is an occasion where there's them wanting to park at their business, I would think they'd have parking at their business potentially to utilize that's not public. So.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right. And could they, in theory, so like picture this, you live in North Medford, you have a car registered to your business. You park it on your street in North Medford. You have to drive to work, which is in West Medford. you could get a business parking permit, park in the business permit spots in West Medford. So you might have both, right? I assume we have people who have resident permit parking in South Medford and business permit parking on the same vehicle.
[Sarah McDermod]: That's very possible. I'm not, I can't say off the top of my head that I know of that, but I mean, they're welcome to purchase both if they qualify for both. Right. It's not an either or situation. Right. So this probably well, that's part of that's 1 of my questions, though, is would this if we're going to allow them to park 24 7 with this, because as if I'm not mistaken, I believe the commercial vehicles during the daytime are allowed to park for an hour. And if they're on a residential street that requires a permit, they still need to display a visitor pass. So, you know, you have work being done at your home. They get an hour. They have to have the pass in. Um, so this.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: They have 8 hours.
[Paul Covino]: Um, Sarah, Sarah, if they're working, they're working, they're allowed to park there. While they're working the 1 hour is a break. Like, if somebody comes home on a lunch break. With a work truck, they're in theory, what was supposed to be, they would have an hour to park. Yeah. In front of their house, right? I was, Sergeant and I, Sergeant Rogers, were both around when this ordinance came, and I was, I disagreed with it, and I didn't like the way it was worded, and it is very vague in some areas, but that's the way it was determined, that you have one hour to park in front of your home only for a break, like lunch. Other than that, if you're working at that home, you can park there for the day, for eight hours, or whatever the work time is.
[Sarah McDermod]: I don't think it says that. I only say that because I'm not sure if my enforcement staff is basing their enforcement on what's written on this ordinance. I don't think it says anywhere that they're allowed to be there for eight hours.
[Paul Covino]: It says they're allowed to be there while working at a property. It doesn't have a timeframe on it. But if they're home on a break, they're only allowed to park there for an hour.
[Alicia Hunt]: How would, how would it be if we know the difference?
[Paul Covino]: That's why it's not a good ordinance. Okay. I, for one, am all in favor for what you're talking about.
[SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[Paul Covino]: Especially due to the fact that many people in the city are blue collar workers that have work vehicles to take home with them.
[Sarah McDermod]: Yeah, I mean, I always thought that 1 hour was a little bit short of amount of time for somebody doing a job, but, um,
[Paul Covino]: I think the ordinance you're looking at has been re-updated so many times that the wording was changed on it, but going back to the day when that came out, that was, you know, we had discussions about it here in the police department about enforcement, and this is what we're stuck with, so.
[Alicia Hunt]: Sarah, I don't really, I'm not familiar with that. Could you circulate that to the rest of the commission?
[Sarah McDermod]: Sure, it's on the web somewhere. It's on our website. It's on the parking website right here under commercial overnight parking prohibited on the right hand side. Thank you. I'll look at it.
[Paul Covino]: And the other thing, when that ordinance was enacted because we did have an overnight commercial prohibited ordinance, then this one came out and it was supposed to be a 24 hour ordinance of no parking commercial vehicles other than those doing work at a establishment, a house or business in the city. And then the one hour rule came into play. So someone who may be working can drive the truck home and park for an hour to go on a lunch or whatever it is.
[Sarah McDermod]: But if they're doing that and they're supposed to have a permit on their street, if they don't put a permit in that car, they would get a ticket still. So that's imperfect as well, unless they have a visitor pass. But you're not supposed to use your visitor pass if you're not a visitor and you live there. So there's a disconnect there as well.
[Paul Covino]: A close personal friend of Sergeant Rogers was instrumental in bringing this together.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: So I'll shut my mouth after that. Commissioners, again, why this was adopted, we had a problem on Ellis Ave. Ellis Ave, where there were eight taxi cabs parking. That's why this was formed. He was not a good friend of mine.
[Alicia Hunt]: As I say, this feels like maybe there was a hammer used when we could have used a scalpel. This is neither here nor there. I appreciate that people took action, but we've all heard some very reasonable reasons why people should be allowed to park a reasonably sized commercial vehicle at their home overnight. Um, which is sort of why I was really a proponent of seeing something. Um, I, if, if the, I'm a little nervous about the whole, like only in front of your house, but then if we have zones, right, like if the person lives in the G zone, it shouldn't be like part of their G the G zone. Right. If we eventually have other zones, you know, how is it in my mind, if you are driving this vehicle, to and from work. And I honestly, I'm not really familiar with lengths and sizes and stuff like that of vehicles. It's not my expertise. But somebody has a sedan or an SUV, you know, they have a personal one, or they have one that's owned by their business. And particularly when their business, you know, that is their own vehicle. They own the business, right? Like, why shouldn't they be able to park this vehicle on the street in front of their house? And I particularly have sympathy for people who live in areas where there's no permit parking and there's plenty of space for these vehicles. And they get ticketed because somebody in the area complains that there's a commercial vehicle parking overnight.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: To kind of piggyback on this, I agree with this, but the other issue that I'd love to tag into this is 48 hour violations. We have looked at this multiple times and similar to Sarah looking at this, we are one of the only cities that do 48 hour violations. Every other city does 72 hours to accommodate residents in their city for going away on the weekend And leaving on a Friday, we are the only city that does a 48 hour piggyback on that. We get an abundance of phone calls, neighbors or whatnot that are using this $40 violation as a way to get back at their neighbors. I don't love the 48 hour, but I'd love to tag it along with our parking rules and regulations on top of this. I don't know if that needs to go to council, but. Yeah, that's a good idea. 48 hour violation is not a, rule that i mean sergeant rogers and chief cabino can kind of attest here we're getting these calls as a neighbor calling on another neighbor and i'm not a huge fan of us towing or tagging i don't believe we should be towing any vehicle that is parked on their own street for a 48 hour or a 72 hour violation that is ridiculous in my eyes
[Alicia Hunt]: So I think I 100% agree with you. And I just think that we should just write that up and submit it to Alva as another item for our agenda. I'd be happy to see it on the September agenda. I just wanna not confuse them and then get one delayed because the other one gets bogged down for some reason.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I can put that as a separate item. So that way we- Gordon, is that an ordinance? Can you hear me? It is a 48 hour ordinance that was also from the time when Sergeant Rogers first got on here in 1978.
[Tim McGivern]: It was an ordinance that might be outside of our purview.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: It's a parking rule and regulation, sorry.
[Tim McGivern]: I agree with Alicia, we should change it. I got a couple of questions on this.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Sorry, I totally took advantage of that. Sorry.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Just while we're talking about the city is being sued, by the final analysis.
[Sarah McDermod]: All right. It's not funny, but no, it is. Yeah, that's interesting.
[Alicia Hunt]: Put it on the September agenda. We'll address it.
[Tim McGivern]: Yeah, that's what it sounds like. Can I ask a couple of questions on the commercial vehicle ordinance? Was the size of vehicle included in there? Because I know a lot of commercial vehicles can be rather large.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: So I have a list of kind of how they break down. sedans, SUV, and commercial vehicle sizes that I could kind of, if you want me to kind of list them out now, I don't mind doing that. So that way you guys can hear it.
[Tim McGivern]: The reason I'm asking it is just if we're gonna codify a rule here, I think we should have something there about size, because I don't want tractor trailer commercial style vehicles parking on the residential streets. So it's gonna be reasonably sized. Yeah, Jordan, I think sharing with Sarah or Alicia or whoever's writing this up to conclude that. information, you know, here's the size that we include. And like Alicia said, we're not going to be ready to vote tonight anyway, so this is just a discussion. I think yes on the 24-7, because I think we're doing something. My, you know, perspective, we've seen basically residents who have company cars that want to park on the streets, so we should probably mirror existing rules. A lot of these cars that are going to fit into these rules and people are going to get a permit for are just that. They're take-home vehicles, so they're almost like their own personal vehicles in a sense. So if they live in the G Zone, I feel like they should be able to park in the G Zone. And if it's non-permit parking, so be it. They just have a permit for a commercial vehicle. But if it's resident permit parking, then they should probably follow the same rules as the resident permit parking for that street. So those are my two cents on this whole thing.
[Alicia Hunt]: Right. And actually, to clarify that, would this literally say if they live on a street with residential permit parking, do they actually just get the residential permit?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: I think that would probably make things easier for Sarah, but Sarah, that's on you.
[Sarah McDermod]: I believe the idea was to Well, when it came to cost, I think the cost of this permit was going to be in line with the business permits, the commercial, I'm sorry, the commuter permits and those similar ones that are at 125 right now, but we could allow it to be used in lieu of the resident permit if they live on a permitted street. So that's why if we restrict this, permit to the resident's address or to the street they live on or the G zone. If they live in the G zone, then we could kill two birds with one stone or, you know, instead of making them buy two, just lump it into that one, should they happen to be in a permit street.
[Paul Covino]: Another thing to consider, we're talking sizes of vehicles. One of the problems we've had in the past where people call and complain because a neighbor has a van or a pickup truck, which that is not the issue, but they have several ladders and equipment hanging off them. So if we could word that in the ordinance so that they're not allowed to have things hanging beyond, you know, however, like six inches beyond. Some people had, we had one guy with a station wagon with ladders hanging out the back, ultimately taking up two pocket spots when he did that. So just some sort of wording so that if you are gonna store equipment or ladders in the truck, that you don't take up more than one spot.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: And to piggyback on the chief there, On that, we had an issue on Lambert Street with a vehicle parking a boat, so trailers and ATVs and other trailers with equipment on it. We had an issue on Private Ways where a pavement company that was doing a driveway parked six commercial trucks and bobcats and things trailered. Anything with a trailer in there would be helpful for us. I mean, we have the orders.
[Sarah McDermod]: Yeah, we'd be covered by the length of the size. If we can, we can maybe add a caveat that the combined. Yeah, I mean, the, we can add a caveat about the width. I mean, sorry, the length of the vehicle, including any attached trailers.
[Tim McGivern]: I also forgot to say one thing. I'm in favor of the exclusivity from the employer, too. In other words, it's just that employee using that vehicle, because we don't want to do car swaps in the middle of the day and have those, you know. And we had with the cabs, too.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Oh, wow.
[Tim McGivern]: So I'd be in favor of that.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Can we confirm if Mr. Hughley's trespassing?
[Paul Covino]: That created a cab company was doing that. So if the cabs weren't parked on the street, the employees were all parked there. So that's what drew attention to that whole problem.
[Sarah McDermod]: Well, I think we can put that in there for a reason in the other city. So it, it seems, I think that the folks who've made the request most recently anyway, it didn't sound like they were trying to share it with another employee. So. I don't think it would impact them. Yeah, I agree.
[Tim McGivern]: The intention of this really is to cater to the exceptions of the commercial vehicle world, because there are so many commercial vehicles we do not want to apply to this rule. You know what I mean? So it's just the people who live here and these very specific rules.
[Paul Covino]: I'm glad we're on. uh, addressing it because it's always been a bone of contention to mind the way that last. It was actually written as if we were like a Belmont or Lexington type town. It was basically ruled out any type of blue collar workers that were here and needed to park on the street. And these other small towns were basically mostly single family homes with driveways. They didn't have these issues.
[Sarah McDermod]: So, well, I mean, I'm not sure that this is necessarily Any more helpful to the blue-collar community though, because a lot of the vans and trucks they would bring home wouldn't meet the criteria as far as markings. I say that because I had a call from Drain Doctor asking why their person kept getting tickets on their van, and it's because it was commercial and had markings all over it. So folks like that wouldn't necessarily benefit if we continue with the size and marking requirements as they are now. A lot of the requests are for just unmarked sedans that happen to have commercial plates. At least you say a lot, but it's maybe two or three that have been tabled that if I recall.
[Paul Covino]: So we only address unmarked vehicles with commercial plates? Is that what we're looking at?
[Alicia Hunt]: Can we discuss that though? Because I feel like in my mind, the 22 feet, so I just looked up a table of the vehicles and I saw a small sedan, 15 feet, full-size F-150. 20 feet, right? So that gave me a sense. So 22 feet is reasonable because then also it's taking up one parking spot. maybe a lot one parking spot, but one. I notice that in this previous version, it talks about having markings as defining it. If it has the markings, then it's commercial, and then it's not allowed. If we're saying some commercial vehicles are allowed, I think we should actively discuss whether or not we care about markings, how much, what, et cetera.
[Paul Covino]: I agree with you on that.
[Alicia Hunt]: And make an active decision.
[Paul Covino]: person that was involved in this was so crazy about if a merry-maids person employee who worked for a cleaning company puts a small sign on the car even though they have passenger plates that they wanted to consider this a commercial vehicle and address it like a commercial vehicle you can have a small for passenger car that's an economy size car and he wanted this this is the way it was presented to us so i'm all for and i don't mind markings if somebody has a van with markings on it but the van is of a normal size no bigger than 20 feet i'm good with that i don't mind markings either but i have gotten feedback from a familiar constituent um to all of you about um
[Sarah McDermod]: Markings on a van parked with a business permit near their home and how that. The image of that might impact the value of their home, having a commercial vehicle within their line of sight, or, you know, the neighborhoods line of sight all the time, or, you know, potentially all the time if we were trying to address to all the people in residence.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: So. Yeah, and this is the city, so I could foresee that.
[Sarah McDermod]: Because when I've gotten, and this is just my limited experience when I've gotten complaints about a commercial vehicle on a street, it's usually 1 with markings because not a lot of people are just taking a look at the plate and they don't they don't want to see him there a lot of time. They're just doing work.
[Paul Covino]: So, it's kind of a commercial vehicle parking.
[Sarah McDermod]: No, I'm talking on the street.
[Paul Covino]: I got a street. Okay.
[Tim McGivern]: Is that an is that an ordinance? Is markings in ordinance or not allowing markings? Is that ordinance, like city council ordinance? It's written in that. It's part of it. It's part of that ordinance. Okay, so what we probably have to do if we want to change anything that's written in ordinance, we probably have to have city council vote on an ordinance change before we can change rules and regulations that may contradict or be different than what's said in ordinance.
[Alicia Hunt]: I think we need to check. I think there's some confusion about using the term ordinance when we mean parking regulations. I don't think that any of this is covered in the city's ordinances, which are on muni code. I think referring to this document, which is the traffic regulation ordinance.
[Tim McGivern]: Okay, then disregard what I said. Sorry, it's just I just wanted to be I didn't want to take any action on this body on rules and regs. If we're not we don't suit up the ordinance first. So thank you, Alicia.
[Alicia Hunt]: Vehicles, I'm gonna give I'm actually going to drop everybody a link to the the ordinances that for the section 78 traffic and vehicles. I'm just trying to grab the link.
[Tim McGivern]: But it sounds like there's a little bit of crafting work still to be done on this. And Sarah, thank you for putting this together.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Definitely should have some conversation about it. I think by September, I think we should be able to lock it down.
[Alicia Hunt]: My thought was that several of these questions that we're asking here, and I've captured a bunch of them in my notes, perhaps we could package them together with the proposal, like the proposal of the language, maybe the language needs to spell some of these out to make it more clear for the public. And if not, if it's an FAQ, whichever way, and then ask the city's communications department, Sarah, whoever, to put it out to the public that this is being discussed. I'd love to say that we're discussing it at the September meeting, and then see what the reaction is, and whether we get, we may very well hear from members of the public that will point things out to us we haven't thought of, that we need more consideration, or they may say everything we discussed tonight, and then we're ready to vote. You know, we don't know what we'll hear.
[Paul Covino]: Well, we know we're going to hear some good and some people say, I don't like the looks of that.
[Jim Silva]: So I have a quick question in regards to the 24247 parking. Most of the other surrounding communities have restricted. It's only overnight parking. So. Maybe because there isn't some sort of parking program that works with commercial vehicles on a daily basis, that that needs to work in conjunction with this because I think 24-7 creates a problem for many areas in Medford that are densely populated. You know, folks, they're paying an excise tax bill in the city of Medford. These folks are not. So I see all of those possibilities of problems. So it's something that needs to be addressed. And again, if we look at the data that was compiled, almost every, with the exception of Chelsea, everyone, it was overnight for those commercial vehicles only.
[Paul Covino]: Right. Daytime parking at all?
[Alicia Hunt]: What if you're home during the day?
[Paul Covino]: Right.
[Alicia Hunt]: What if you work nights? Or what if you like, I'm home sick and so my vehicle is... Can we back up one second?
[Paul Covino]: Prior to this ordinance that we currently have, our commercial vehicle parking was for overnight only. So you were allowed in theory, to park on the streets in a commercial vehicle. And I'm wondering, Jim, if that's not what you're seeing in these other cities and towns, that they're only addressing overnight parking and there is no restriction during the daytime.
[Jim Silva]: I think it depends on the community. I know the city of Austin, if you have commercial plate, you can park in a resident parking location because the idea is as long as there's lettering on the side of the car, like a real estate or something of that value. So I don't think we even have that kind of detail at this point. So I also think it was done specifically to prevent any kind of abuses and that perspective that folks are not paying excise taxes, et cetera. So I think the overnight is probably practical as the approach initially, so that it allows people to understand this is an overnight process. And then if we receive feedback that there is a request for others or folks during the day, then that can be addressed as an addendum to this.
[Paul Covino]: I think it'll be gone, but I also think that if we just make the rules and regulations in line with just overnight stuff and don't address daytime, there's no question there, right? They park there and they don't park there. And I think what you're saying is, if it becomes an issue, then we address it.
[Jim Silva]: What we see here, I mean, I've been to a number of these traffic commission meetings and always the request has been for overnight commercial parking. There hasn't been anything during the day, primarily that when it's been submitted to traffic commission, it seems to be overnight. And call me wrong, but I believe that's just been what I've seen and what I've reviewed. But again, these other communities are doing overnight. I live in South Medford, as you know, and it's a very densely populated environment. And this sort of helps people who may have a commercial vehicle. And again, I understand within the limits, and that should be addressed as well. Because when it says within vehicle size and marketing requirements, it's sort of like, what does that mean? So that part of this as well. So it's clear to people.
[Paul Covino]: Yeah. So one thing about this current rule that we have, I think we We've always we were brought up on the overnight commercial vehicle parking term and then this rule came in and the difficulty of enforcing it was. here we go, am I on there? So the difficulty of enforcing it was, how do we know they're only parked there for an hour? So if somebody's there working on the house, that's easy to determine. But if somebody calls and say, hey, my neighbor's in front of his house, he's been parked there for two hours, we don't know that. Now we have to go and, in theory, chalk the wheel and come back for an hour. So I think just addressing overnight is the right issue to do.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: Chief, I just have one comment. If I'm a painter, and I have a van, and I get out of work at 7 o'clock at night, where do I park until midnight?
[Paul Covino]: I think what we're saying is, there will be no restriction during the daytime, unless it becomes an issue. Okay. Then we want to address it. But all the other cities and towns around us only address overnight commercial vehicles.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: I'd rather 24-7.
[Jim Silva]: I think also just from a perspective of why these other communities have done overnight, that's generally has been the request. Maybe we need to see the reality of the request and then make a better judgment and then go from there. I think it's really important to see exactly what is being requested. It defines this, it allows this to occur, but it keeps it within parameters that is enforceable and helps people sort of digest this.
[Paul Covino]: I'm all for it. I think it's definitely something that needs to be readdressed. I think we can have a good conversation on that.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Motion to adjourn the meeting.
[Alicia Hunt]: We need to know what we're putting. Sarah, I'm happy to send you my notes.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: It's helpful. I think if you own it, Sarah, you want to email Alva, we can get it on for September and then share the Zoom link. We'll have plenty of time to look at it.
[Alicia Hunt]: And somebody will talk with comms about doing some outreach on this?
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Are you able to do that?
[Alicia Hunt]: How about you copy me, because I'm talking to them a lot about another issue, and I don't want it to get confused.
[Sarah McDermod]: Yeah, I actually have a couple of things I've asked them for this week already. Or in the last couple of weeks, so I'll add you. Alicia, anybody else want to be in that conversation? If not, I understand what was that conversation between with communications to discuss getting the word out about this being on the agenda once it's on the agenda.
[Paul Covino]: Okay. You can keep me out of that 1. okay. I sent up Steve. Is he here?
[Tim McGivern]: I signed up Todd. Todd's here.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Well, I think we're motion to adjourn. Uh, second, second. I don't think we need a roll call. Do it. Sorry, chief. That's all I get from the summer and I don't text and drive.
[4FrRjkCyMqA_SPEAKER_06]: All right.
[Tim McGivern]: The A's have it.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Thank you, everybody. Enjoy your summer.
[Tim McGivern]: Good night, everybody.
[MCM00001829_SPEAKER_08]: Good night. 809 adjourned.